Is OMC really to be avoided???

[TilliamWe]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

td and bubba, I like Ford 302s, I really do. But since Ford no longer makes the engine and hasn't supplied it to the marine indusrty in 20 years, that makes marine specific parts for it obsolete. No thanks.
And td, a properly maintained Chevy will last just as long as a properly maintained Ford. And most people don't use their boats enough to wear out the engines. But exhaust manifolds do fail, and then you are screwed when it comes to buying them for a Ford. Sorry, that's just a fact.

 

[HT32BSX115]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

Just because NADA doesn't deduct for a Cobra means nothing really.....

They don't deduct for a 460 King Cobra either and they're worth even LESS! For 2 years now there's been NO supplier for 460 manifolds. I think you can get them now though. Twice the price as for a similar GM Merc/Volvo Engine.

They don't deduct for a Cobra with a Spitfire ignition. You cannot buy parts for the OMC Spitfire ignition. This doesn't mean you can't fix the engine, it just means that you have replace the ignition with something after-market like Mallory, MSD, or $$$.




This stuff has been hashed out may times here and other boat boards.


The company has been out of business for more than 10 years. They aren't coming back. NO ONE puts a Ford marine engine in boats anymore. That doesn't mean that there's something wrong with Fords. (I have a 55 Ford truck....I love it!!)

It DOES MEAN that you're buying a boat that will have less and less support as time goes on.

If you already own one (because you made the mistake of not asking people who know......) Well there's a lot of people here who have pulled the trigger and have lots of experience fixing them.

No one is dogging them......at least not me!!! I'm one of 'em I made the maximum transgression! I bought a boat with a 460 King Cobra installed and didn't ask a soul!! (I am mechanically inclined, have an engr degree, fix all my own stuff, even did my own complete OMC --> Mercury swap......no one can tell me anything!!!!!) (Well, maybe Don, Bondo, Rodbolt!! [and everybody else!])

Bottom line. If you don't have a boat, and are buying one for the first time.....(and no one is holding a gun to your head.......)

Heed this advice. DON'T BUY AN OMC POWERED BOAT.



Cheers,


Rick

 

[slasmith1]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

Just because NADA doesn't deduct for a Cobra means nothing really.....

They don't deduct for a 460 King Cobra either and they're worth even LESS! For 2 years now there's been NO supplier for 460 manifolds. I think you can get them now though. Twice the price as for a similar GM Merc/Volvo Engine.

They don't deduct for a Cobra with a Spitfire ignition. You cannot buy parts for the OMC Spitfire ignition. This doesn't mean you can't fix the engine, it just means that you have replace the ignition with something after-market like Mallory, MSD, or $$$.




This stuff has been hashed out may times here and other boat boards.


The company has been out of business for more than 10 years. They aren't coming back. NO ONE puts a Ford marine engine in boats anymore. That doesn't mean that there's something wrong with Fords. (I have a 55 Ford truck....I love it!!)

It DOES MEAN that you're buying a boat that will have less and less support as time goes on.

If you already own one (because you made the mistake of not asking people who know......) Well there's a lot of people here who have pulled the trigger and have lots of experience fixing them.

No one is dogging them......at least not me!!! I'm one of 'em I made the maximum transgression! I bought a boat with a 460 King Cobra installed and didn't ask a soul!! (I am mechanically inclined, have an engr degree, fix all my own stuff, even did my own complete OMC --> Mercury swap......no one can tell me anything!!!!!) (Well, maybe Don, Bondo, Rodbolt!! [and everybody else!])

Bottom line. If you don't have a boat, and are buying one for the first time.....(and no one is holding a gun to your head.......)

Heed this advice. DON'T BUY AN OMC POWERED BOAT.



Cheers,


Rick

And just because you bought a POS that hadn't been properly maintained doesn't mean they are all bad 302 may not be the best choice but parts can always be found I never had a problem for any routine maint. parts. but because of all the naysayers on omc I bought a used drive when I saw one locally for a reasonable price just in case.
I never needed it not even for spare parts.

 

[SS194]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

I hate to do this guys, but the Chris Craft is out of the question. The owner sent me an e-mail saying that it's got a soft spot in the floor. That's not something I'm willing to deal with.

This is probably the boat I'm after now. The only thing I don't like is it's a 6. It's a Merc though! What do you guys know about this engine???

Here's my other thread...The craigslist link is in the first post, then halfway down the first page are a few more pictures that the ower sent me.

http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=307495

 

[MikDee]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

That 4.3 is a wonderful, peppy, sturdy motor, especially with the vortec heads! You do know it's a 350 small block with 2 cyls cut off, 262 cu in. and these guys over at the S-10 forum are all about this motor!

http://www.s10forum.com/forum/262ci-forum-4-3/

 

[SS194]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

No, I did not know that and I am all of a sudden very excited! I can't wait to read more on the S10 forums.

Are there hop ups for this engine that work in a marine application?

Thanks for that little bit of information!
Steve

 

[MikDee]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

No, I did not know that and I am all of a sudden very excited! I can't wait to read more on the S10 forums.

Are there hop ups for this engine that work in a marine application?

Thanks for that little bit of information!
Steve

You Bet! But just the right 4bbl & manifold should make it plenty fast for you to start with, alot of guys on this board have done this. There are vortec heads available if you don't have them already, and marine cams. This engine is quickly replacing the older Chevy 305's and spins up faster then any of the V8's because of less friction with 2 less cylinders, But they are big 4" pistons, & a 3:48" stroke like the 350.

 

[SS194]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

Sounds like I have a lot of reading to do!

Thanks for your help.

Steve

 

[180shabah]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

Don't let the v6 scare you. I have a pre vortec 4bbl(175 hp at the prop) in an 18' BR, the boat runs 48mph WOT with normal (30 gal. fuel and about 650lbs of passengers and gear) load. Always makes me smile when I take off hard and just as the tach swings past 4600 and the prop shifts from 17" to 23" pitch and the RPM's drop back to about 3400 and she keeps pullin'.

Are there hop ups for this engine that work in a marine application?

A 4bbl carb on a good intake manifold will place you in the 220-230 hp range. Remeber that we talk propshaft hp, and the "S10 guys" will be talking crankshaft hp, with an alpha drive(or VP SX) there is about a 30hp difference. There are gains to be had with cam selection and exhaust, but the gains are very minimal when you look at the very high cost and the risks (primarily water intrusion) associated with these changes.

Would I rather have a v8 - only at startup, I love that sound. I have a small boat and the extra hundred pounds dead on the stern would have a real impact, especialy transitioning to and from plane.

 

[HT32BSX115]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

And just because you bought a POS that hadn't been properly maintained doesn't mean they are all bad 302 may not be the best choice but parts can always be found I never had a problem for any routine maint. parts. but because of all the naysayers on omc I bought a used drive when I saw one locally for a reasonable price just in case.
I never needed it not even for spare parts.

Hmm....you're not getting the main point.

No. I did not buy a POS. It was properly maintained. My Brother bought it NEW.

I had a boat that I couldn't fix if the manifolds or coupler failed.......those are "wear items" by the way........
[NO ONE AT THE TIME I bought it MADE REPLACEMENT MANIFOLDS OR COUPLER] I'm not sure you can even buy them now. Although Doug Russell indicates that they have them..... There are other parts that are also "NOT AVAILABLE"



I am NOT speaking to people that already have these engines/drives.


I am only suggesting that people who are looking for boats to AVOID OMC.

Those people that have already "pulled the trigger" deserve all the help they need. But those that have not "done the deed",

well DON'T do it!

 

[wil7483]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

Perfectly said Rick.

 

[HT32BSX115]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

Perfectly said Rick.

Hey thanks, from one OMC 460 Kobra guy to another!......

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

If that truly was a 94 then it would be the Volvo joint venture. It doesn't look like it though. $7000 is also way too much for that boat.

 

[HT32BSX115]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

If that truly was a 94 then it would be the Volvo joint venture. It doesn't look like it though. $7000 is also way too much for that boat.

I could be wrong here (Don would know for sure probably) but the "Joint Venture" drive was the SX drive. The cone clutch drive that started in 90 on the big blocks and was later used on all the Cobras up until around 94/95 was not the same as the SX (although I think the cone clutch used was a VP design)

If you look at the parts break down for 96 models, they even call the gear housing assy SX. (in 95 they call the lower SX) But there's no mention of SX in the upper gear housing..... In 94 the parts list doesn't mention SX at all.


It's clear that OMC was switching to VP drive components in 94-95-96.... But it appears that it wasn't all at once.


Back to the original argument....boats that were new in the mid to late 90's are all over the place. Merc and Volvo powered.

Other things are starting to go wrong with them like the aforementioned rotten floor, rotten stringers, rotten transoms, as well as engine, drive, electrical problems etc.....

If you're looking for your first (or even second) boat why compound your problems by selecting an engine/drive combination that was made by a company that no longer exists when there's a LOT of boats with engines/drives still being made and well supported?


That the real question to ask.

After you answer that, you're better equipped to make the decision.


Cheers,


Rick

 

[SS194]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

Rick, do you fly for Alaska airlines???

180, you said when you punch it, the revs shoot up, then the prop changes pitch 6 degrees?

Am I reading that right?

Steve

 

[180shabah]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

180, you said when you punch it, the revs shoot up, then the prop changes pitch 6 degrees?

YUP!

Currently running a Quicksilver Powershift prop, I cannot confirm this, but I believe it was originally made by aerostar marine for quicksilver. Aerostar still makes an almost identical prop called the power pitch and sells for about $2000.

Hopefully this summer I will be joining Bondo and running a torqushift prop. Starts with an 11" pitch and has a continuous "soft" shift up to an adjustable high pitch. I guess I will probably end up around 22" on the top end, but we'll see. These are no longer made so scrounging up usable parts took a little while.

 

[slasmith1]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

These are no longer made so scrounging up usable parts took a little while.

What you are using a part that is no longer made you better hurry up and throw it away like all these crappy cobra drives.

 

[180shabah]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

What you are using a part that is no longer made you better hurry up and throw it away like all these crappy cobra drives.

Somehow I knew that was coming. When (If, there is a startup company that is just starting to produce the wear items) the day comes that I can't get rpl parts, it'll be a whole lot easier to throw away a $300 prop than a $3000 drive.

Besides we'll all be SOL if GM doesn't get their act together soon. Either that or we'll be going back to Ford power, or possibly Honda or Toyota.

 

[a70eliminator]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

Oh you guys act like Cobra drives are THE only ones you can't get parts for, heck theres a guy right now asking about some part on his 80's 200 hp evinrude that is NA guess it's junk too.


http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?p=2065877#post2065877

 

[HT32BSX115]

Re: Is OMC really to be avoided???

What you are using a part that is no longer made you better hurry up and throw it away like all these crappy cobra drives.

Alas I think you jest!

I don't think anyone here has suggested that people should "throw away" Cobras.
I just sold my (460) King Cobra drive, manifolds, risers, and other small parts for about $1400 to a guy that was pretty grateful to get them......(cuz they're hard to find)

I will keep suggesting that people who out there "on the buy", to avoid them!