Johnson or Mercury

[tx1961whaler]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

in this case id go for the merc!now for the rest ,what a bunch a unmitigated crap about the electic shifts !i now have my 3rd one .first 2 were 55 hp johnny and 55 rude ,put tons and i mean tons of hours on them with nary a problem.as a matter of fact we wacked a rock with the rude ,cracked the lower housing all to heck got her welded and used her for many years after with no problems.a lot of the problems with elect shift were owner induced,wrong lower unit fluid,low or poor batteries ,etc.as oldmercsrule is so fond of saying i know from experience not just from hear-say!my newest electshift is 46 years old and still ticking!p.s. you think its hard to find parts for a i6, try finding parts for a 63 75 electshift.ya got to love em or you,d go nuts,lol.

I have had quite a few electric shifts (electromatic and hydro), and have had mixed results. It was also a salt water environment which ate them alive. And no, it was not owner induced, except that I actually used the motors year round in salt water. One incidence of salt water intrusion in the gearcase, and you were living on borrowed time. Same with the controls. Interesting that the OMC commercial motors of that era were manual shifts.....
I think the bigger point is, if someone had a choice today to buy an (old) electric shift motor, should they buy it? Given a choice between a manual and electric shift, I'd say no to the electric shift. There are too many NLA parts in both the electromatic and hydroelectric gearcases and remote controls to consider in a new purchase.

 

[cougar1985]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

I have had quite a few electric shifts (electromatic and hydro), and have had mixed results. It was also a salt water environment which ate them alive. And no, it was not owner induced, except that I actually used the motors year round in salt water. One incidence of salt water intrusion in the gearcase, and you were living on borrowed time. Same with the controls. Interesting that the OMC commercial motors of that era were manual shifts.....
I think the bigger point is, if someone had a choice today to buy an (old) electric shift motor, should they buy it? Given a choice between a manual and electric shift, I'd say no to the electric shift. There are too many NLA parts in both the electromatic and hydroelectric gearcases and remote controls to consider in a new purchase.

well if i hit salt water ive gone a couple of thousand miles east ,lol.salt water intrusion for any motor is bad news period i would think but your correct elect shift would be that much more so.ive never had any major problems other than the gearcase being shatttered (self induced) and it was fixed and she still ran good.were i am there,s still quite a few elect shift motors running around and the corrosive effects of saltwater are not heard of.i would think if you are running in a salt area you,d have to be extra vigilant for sure and that goes for any motor i would think?and yes oldmercs they were the triples(55hp)!i got my current elect shift for free so no loss if it went bad later on, though i suspect it wont happen any time soon.id also buy one for parts if i could .

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

Yup. Those three cylinder Johnnyrude loopers 55 HP to 75 HP or some such were real fast light weight powerful engines that dominated all takers in their particular HP range (regardless of who manufactured 'em).

Kinda like the inline6 Mercs did in the slightly more powerful catergory of outboard engines, (that this thread is about).

The inline6s and 4s had mild steel driveshafts, butt: the 1975 to 1988 LU (with stainless steel drive shafts), bolts right up, n' there are more inline6 Mercs then any other high powered engine ever made.

Me overpriced $.02. JR

 

[Boss Hawg]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

I also think the Mercs have a lot of high-dollar electrical parts, 

As do Johnnyrudes n' Yammadingers et al. The inline6s electrical stuff is nearly bullet proof, (in case ya wondered), so it is real rare ya gotta buy a cdi et al.

I have to agree there- I have to replace a 35 watt recterfier on my '87 110hp for a mere $200+

 

[Tacklewasher]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

The 85hp Johnson V4 is my least favorite of the V4's. Nothing wrong with it but it is heavy for the HP. It's the same weight as the 140hp of that era. I have a 115hp and, it is a good motor, but I would take a 3 cyl 70hp over the 85 just based on the hp to weight.

Don't know enough about merc's to comment.

 

[Boss Hawg]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

The 85hp Johnson V4 is my least favorite of the V4's. Nothing wrong with it but it is heavy for the HP. It's the same weight as the 140hp of that era. I have a 115hp and, it is a good motor, but I would take a 3 cyl 70hp over the 85 just based on the hp to weight.

Don't know enough about merc's to comment.

Kinda hate to keep jumpin in without addin any usefull info but i a 86 70hp awhile back & it was deffeninatly a runner

 

[Reg312]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

Never got 2 pages out of a post before. All info very appreciated. Think I'll lean towards the Merc seeing someone mentioned my question was like comparing Ford to Chevy. Since I'm lookin at a Merc., that will e the ford and the Johnson the Chevy. ANd, since I have a prejudice against Chevys, the Mercs looking good. Plus the merc is attached to a $550 boat and the Johnson to a $1500 boat. I don't want either boats just the motor. Will resell boats and trailers. Thanks for all the info.

 

[trendsetter240]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

Never got 2 pages out of a post before. All info very appreciated. Think I'll lean towards the Merc seeing someone mentioned my question was like comparing Ford to Chevy. Since I'm lookin at a Merc., that will e the ford and the Johnson the Chevy. ANd, since I have a prejudice against Chevys, the Mercs looking good. Plus the merc is attached to a $550 boat and the Johnson to a $1500 boat. I don't want either boats just the motor. Will resell boats and trailers. Thanks for all the info.

After reading through the posts on here it sounds to me like you will be happier with the merc after all.

Also:

I'm running a Merc 115 now but its without tilt and trim

If the 115 you have now is a similar year you have a parts engine, spare set of controls etc. That is assuming that you aren't selling your old motor.

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

Reg312 states: Never got 2 pages out of a post before.

Yer lucky it did, if ya woulda stated there was a three to one price difference, (n' you were already runnin' a Merc on the VERY first post), it would have been hard fer even the illogical Johnnyrude fanitics ta corntinue the pro Johnny chatter as long as they did, fer a much less powerful engine with a big potential LU problem (once the likely age trickled out as well).

All info very appreciated.

Yer wellcome, I'm glad ya flushed out some of the anti Merc fellers here on iboats mesself.

Think I'll lean towards the Merc seeing someone mentioned my question was like comparing Ford to Chevy.

Nawh has nothin' ta do with Ford vs Chev, (that may have got the number of posts yer talkin' 'bout in this thread in this particular post). It actually has more to do with a functional brain cell or two in yer noggin'. IE: with a three to one price difference; 35% less power; much more werk ta hang the Johnny on yer boat where a Merc now hangs; you'd be nuts ta choose a 'lectric shift underpowered n' heavy v-4 Johnny. Plain as the day is long.

Since I'm lookin at a Merc., that will e the ford and the Johnson the Chevy. ANd, since I have a prejudice against Chevys, the Mercs looking good. Plus the merc is attached to a $550 boat and the Johnson to a $1500 boat. I don't want either boats just the motor. Will resell boats and trailers. Thanks for all the info.

Hmmmmmmm......... ya say. Yer wellcome fer the info. Good luck. JR

 

[Reg312]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

If I would have bought the Johnny I would have swapped out the motors and resold that boat with the merc. So, me having a merc would have tainted the discussion. But I do have a Merc on my signature post so that could have given that away. If I were to buy the Merc, I would have either sold the boat trailer for a couple hundred or given it to the kids to work on, and keep the merc for parts. Remember I'm shooting for the tilt trim units on these boats since mine doesn't have one. So my question was genuine. I really wanted a logical discussion on these 2 motors since this was my first real season of boating. I also have a budget that I need to keep to cause I see a stripped pontoon in my near future, with lawn chairs &, trolling motor to piddle around my cove and fish in comfort. the Mercs for dagging the kids around the bigger part of the lake.

 

[bryanwess2000]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

I didn't think omc made a 85hp in 1985 only a 90hp and maybe a 88spl.
both the omc and merc are gonna weigh around 300lbs. More reliable
would favor omc but the condition of each motor is more important.
They're probably going to use about the same amount of fuel considering they're the same displacement 99.6ci. I've read mercs are harder to work
on and the towers of power are more prone to overheat due to the I6 configuration. I favor merc because I have a 1977 850 thats been pretty
trouble free other than rewiring and had a 50hp johnson blow up after
2mos ownership. The johnson was just probably poorly rebuilt or ran lean
due to dirty carbs, I'll never know but I'm biased now. I'd prefer the newer
motor but again condition of each is more impotant. All things being equal
the omc would be worth more in my area.

 

[jbjennings]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

Never got 2 pages out of a post before. All info very appreciated. Think I'll lean towards the Merc seeing someone mentioned my question was like comparing Ford to Chevy. Since I'm lookin at a Merc., that will e the ford and the Johnson the Chevy. ANd, since I have a prejudice against Chevys, the Mercs looking good. Plus the merc is attached to a $550 boat and the Johnson to a $1500 boat. I don't want either boats just the motor. Will resell boats and trailers. Thanks for all the info.

Prejudice against CHevy's???????????
Aw heck,
You deserve the Mercury!!!!!
Seriously, though--------do you know how to work on a Mercury? ----from my limited experience, it's harder than a Johnson. The electric shift is a good system (I've owned one), but harder or impossible to find parts for, and EASY to screw up if you're unfamiliar with it.
From my point of view, the only persons still running mercury tower of powers are those few experts who can work on them in their sleep. That ain't me. I think the I6's are some of the coolest/sharpest motors ever built, and would LOVE to have one on a nice speedboat. I would NOT look forward to working on one, though!:redface:

Good luck with either,
JBJ

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

Jbjennings; states: Prejudice against CHevy's???????????
Aw heck,
You deserve the Mercury!!!!!
Seriously, though--------do you know how to work on a Mercury? ----from my limited experience,

JBJ keyword LIMITED.

The unknown is always skeeeeeeery.

I have only one functional brain cell and the Mercs are jus' as easy (or hard as), the Johnnyrudes; ('cept maybe the rings), which I have not personally done so: I really dunno.

I READ, (there is that dirty word again), ya have ta do all six rings at once n' the only ol' Black girl I ever totally rebuilt was a 1976 1500 (n' that was by a pro inline6 Guru). wink wink snark snark


it's harder than a Johnson.

All the stuff I've done indicates a similar level of difficulty, n' admittadly I do run more Mercs then Johnnrudes, butt I find 'em equally easy. Both great engines: IMHO.

The electric shift is a good system (I've owned one), but harder or impossible to find parts for, and EASY to screw up if you're unfamiliar with it.
From my point of view, the only persons still running mercury tower of powers are those few experts who can work on them in their sleep.

Nawh I can't werk on 'em when I'm sleepin' or snooooooooozin': JBJ. I can werk on 'em when awake, n' I do only have a single functional brain cell; so if I can do it: you surely can!!!

That ain't me. I think the I6's are some of the coolest/sharpest motors ever built, and would LOVE to have one on a nice speedboat.

Thanks, I'll tell the girls, (BTW I don't werk on 'em very much as they are very reliable if ya jus' take care of 'em). I do run 'em mainly in fresh water n' always wash 'em real good if they get any salt action.

I would NOT look forward to working on one, though!:redface:

Nawh: JBJ, yer jus' skeeeeeeered of the unknown. Buy one of 'em n' make sure she is a fresh water virgin with even cornpression ta start. Warnin'........ once ya go Black; yer never goin' back there: Young feller!!!

Good luck with either,
JBJ

Yup, JR

 

[TitanTea]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

I have an old Johnson and a mid 70's Mercury. The Johnson sits in the shed....

 

[aganser]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

I have and like both, although much smaller and older than motors listed here.

Years ago I had an old outboard mechanic tell me this:

"Mercurys are the girls you want to date, OMC's are the girls you want to marry".



Bob

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

I have and like both, although much smaller and older than motors listed here.

Years ago I had an old outboard mechanic tell me this:

"Mercurys are the girls you want to date, OMC's are the girls you want to marry".



Bob

Hmmmmm....... unless ya like yer women real purdy....real fast....Black....n'....REAL WILD....as I do. JR

 

[aganser]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

Hmmmmm....... unless ya like yer women real purdy....real fast....Black....n'....REAL WILD....as I do. JR

Those Towers of Power are cool, but I have all I can handle with the green tank motors on my 12 foot tinny!

Other than the color they seem to fit your discription to a tee.

Just like your handle says... Old Mercs do rule!

Carl made some legends!

Bob

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

Unless the Johnson is older than a 1973, it doesn't have electric shift and electric shift is not why OMC went out of business. Further, I have a 1972 Johnson 65hp motor, which does have hydro-electric shift, and run it much more often than most people run an outboard. The motor is rock solid and the only time that I have ever had to come home on the kicker, was the result of an ignition problem and a piece of junk in one of the carbs, at the same time. This is something that could happen on any carbed motor.

As for which one to buy, I'll simply ask this - how many, still serviceable Johnsons/Evinrudes of an older vintage do you still see around, v. Mercury motors?



???

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

Jay_merrill states:

Unless the Johnson is older than a 1973, it doesn't have electric shift and electric shift is not why OMC went out of business.

There was not a single reason fer OMC's face plant, n' the electric shift reputation was not helpful and was part of the reason, maybe the early direct injection problems were a bigger deal, (which were Gubmint regulation related).

Anytime Nanny Gubmint sets rules some win n' some loose.

Either way Merc has stayed in bidness with Brunswick since 1960 or 61 n' OMC went BK n' changed owners. Facts are facts n' truth is truth.


Further, I have a 1972 Johnson 65hp motor, which does have hydro-electric shift, and run it much more often than most people run an outboard. The motor is rock solid and the only time that I have ever had to come home on the kicker, was the result of an ignition problem and a piece of junk in one of the carbs, at the same time. This is something that could happen on any carbed motor.

I have had similer experience with a 1968 1250, n' Johnnyrudes are fine engines. That said: It would be foolish ta pay three times the price fer a heavy v-4 85 HP engine when a similar shape same weight 1150, (35% MORE POWER) was available n' the feller's boat already has a Merc 115 tower, so the job ta hang the engine would be far easier.

That relatively ugly hog 85 v-4 would be a slug cornpared to that purdy Black girl n' the feller would really regret spendin' 3x the money. Facts are facts n' truth is truth.

As for which one to buy, I'll simply ask this - how many, still serviceable Johnsons/Evinrudes of an older vintage do you still see around, v. Mercury motors?

I'd say there are far more Mercs. Prolly due to the fact that FAR MORE MERCS WERE SOLD IN THE FIRST PLACE.....................

Ya think?????Respectfully, JR



???

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Johnson or Mercury

I will stand by my comments and invite the OP to research the issues at hand. The information has been presented, he can make up is own mind.



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