Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

[jontoronto27]

Ladies and Gents;

I took my OMC 400 outdrive to a mechanic here in the Toronto area that specializes in marine.. my reverse gear was shattered in the lower unit and I couldn't get it out of forward. I took it to the repair place. Quoted 1500 cash for a complete rebuild. Picked up the thing, got home, gear oil in a small puddle in the back of the truck. Installed the drive, took it out the first trip it hits the water.. I'm 2 miles from the marina, the outdrive seizes and and tilts up, (engine saved by the smoothed out ball gears causing it to tilt) Well after paddling 3 hours back to the marina, call up the mechanic who did it, says he didn't touch the upper unit (I think it seized) and that he's not respsonsible for it failing and it was up to me to check the fluid levels.

What would you do if that happened to you (please keep it legal). LOL

thanks!

btw. I told my mechanic 3 times that it was leaking gear oil all over the place and he told me not to worry and that he over filled it.

 

[whywhyzed]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

If your ball gears are worn on a 45 deg angle, that's probably what destroyed the upper. That angle pushes the horizontal shaft tight into the back bearing with huge thrust,and spins it in the bore.
Was it the place in Scarborough you took it to, starts with T.? I'm surprised he'd let a drive go out without mentioning the upper ball gear wear and his concern.

What I would do? Write it off to education. Look for a good used upper. Too bad the supershopper went for such a crap- it used to be a great place to find OMC parts.

 

[jontoronto27]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

Nope it was up in markham. I took it back to him, and he told me the reason why the upper seized is because water got into it. And even though he replaced the impeller, he didn't touch the upper and therefore has nothing to do with him. I he told me fixed the lower unit for 1500 and that's what I got (I never was able to get it in reverse, even after I got it back) and after trying it he said he wouldn't touch it anymore until I got him a new cable. So I'm out 1500 bucks now for an outdrive that still doesn't shift, but now has a seized upper

 

[Lyndy]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

Hmmm, Specializes in Marine stuff but did not inspect the outdrive for other possible problems. Even if he did not do anything with the Upper specifically, he did replace the impeller that is directly connected to a shaft that is connected to the shaft that goes up to the Bearing Assembly and Pinion Gear. Again no inspection for other problems. He sounds like a typical R&R Mechanic. Not Good Customer Service and Professionalism. I can feel your pain! Are you going to let him fix the Upper??????

 

[whywhyzed]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

Markham? can't think where that would be.... but anyways, the guy who specializes in those drives, who used to work for the OMC factory and rebuilds 2 or 3 OMC stringer drives per day is in Scarborough. All he's been doing for 5 years is stringers. Not sure who sent you to markham but live and learn. PM me for the info.

 

[whywhyzed]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

p.s. the water entered after the rear upper bearing spun and the horizontal shaft walked back enough to wipe the seal out.

 

[jontoronto27]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

Hmmm, Specializes in Marine stuff but did not inspect the outdrive for other possible problems. Even if he did not do anything with the Upper specifically, he did replace the impeller that is directly connected to a shaft that is connected to the shaft that goes up to the Bearing Assembly and Pinion Gear. Again no inspection for other problems. He sounds like a typical R&R Mechanic. Not Good Customer Service and Professionalism. I can feel your pain! Are you going to let him fix the Upper??????

NO!!! Right now I have the whole outdrive in 48 pieces in the back of my truck now because he wouldn't put it back together for me. I know why he's flat out refusing though, have you seen the price of 400 uppers? I'm up poops creek without an outdrive lol I don't know what I'm going to do about the 1500 bucks, I think it may end up in court but I just don't know. I'll definately post an update, maybe it will help other people if they ever get hosed like me.

 

[Lyndy]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

Do you at least have a functioning Lower? There are 400 Uppers on Ebay all the time. Depends on your patience and how much you are willing to learn about your Drive so you can recognize a good deal. Craig's List is also a good source for parts.

Oh, btw, I have been mulling over your comment about overfilling the Lower Case. Where in the hell would the Lower Case leak if it were overfilled? Also, if he knew he overfilled it, why didn't he just let some of it out? Can't help but think this person was a real winner. I just feel sorry he took you so hard.

 

[jontoronto27]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

Do you at least have a functioning Lower? There are 400 Uppers on Ebay all the time. Depends on your patience and how much you are willing to learn about your Drive so you can recognize a good deal. Craig's List is also a good source for parts.

Oh, btw, I have been mulling over your comment about overfilling the Lower Case. Where in the hell would the Lower Case leak if it were overfilled? Also, if he knew he overfilled it, why didn't he just let some of it out? Can't help but think this person was a real winner. I just feel sorry he took you so hard.

Well I'm going to look at a 1984 400 today the guy wants 1200 for it, I'll offer him 900 as it needs balls gears, the worst he could do is tell me the screw off lol. I saw an upper go on ebay the other day for about 200 bucks, and it was in good condition. But the pickle I'm in now is, the lower still doesn't shift. the guy I took it to who rebuilt it ripped the indexed end of the shift cable off when he was trying to reef it though the intermediate housing, and for 900, I have a complete piece. So I don't have to take things apart again. He said he overfilled the upper not the lower and that's why it leaked so much. He also used Mercruiser gear lube in both upper and lower. I think I'm going to get the whole outdrive, have it inspected by someone else, and then figure out what I can do to get some of my money back. I keep trying to call OMC for the location of a dealer, but they're not returning my calls.

And I was kidding about that last part LOL

 

[Lyndy]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

Yeah, Their customer Service kind of sucks nowadays. Mercruiser Gear Lube? Amazing! I recently inventoried the liquids that were left behind on my SKipJack and found two 1 quart bottles of QuickSilver Gear Lube. One was almost empty and the second also partially empty. On the back in text bigger than the rest "Do not use on OMC Electric Shift Sterndrives". Of coarse that is what my OMC Mogrel Drive is. Now I wonder where the missing Gear Lube went to? My adventure continues.

 

[whywhyzed]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

Mercruiser gear lube is fine in a 1978 Stringer. It's fine in the upper of any stringer, just not the lowers 1964-1977

 

[Lyndy]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

Mercruiser gear lube is fine in a 1978 Stringer. It's fine in the upper of any stringer, just not the lowers 1964-1977

Did things change in 78? My 75 Service manual actually recommends OMC Premium Blend Gearcase Lube for both upper and lower.

 

[jontoronto27]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

Did things change in 78? My 75 Service manual actually recommends OMC Premium Blend Gearcase Lube for both upper and lower.

Okay in the Seloc it says 1964-1977 you need OMC type "C" since 1978 you need OMC Hi-Vis Gearcase Lube. I bought a thing of Castrol 80W-90 SAE that says "Hypoy-c" on it, and I'm looking at the top of the page here and it says "DO NOT USE SAE 90 IN EITHER UPPER OR LOWER GEARCASE" so I think I'm returning that. Since 1978 though Johnson/Evinrude has come out with their own stuff for OMC 400 outdrives.

I just got back from a little road trip, went out and bought a 1984 OMC 400 complete and the shift cable looks brand spankin' new! the boat was in good condition as well but it had a blown engine so they were parting it out. I paid 1000 for it. but If it solves my headaches then I can't complain, plus I can still sell my old lower unit to make up for it.

 

[whywhyzed]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

I just got back from a little road trip, went out and bought a 1984 OMC 400 complete and the shift cable looks brand spankin' new!

1984 is a straight mechanical shift drive and requires an ESA system be installed or you'll have a hell of a time shifting out of gear, eventually breaking the cable if you don't crash.....
You will also need a different shift converter for atop the intermediate housing as they are different.

Sorry the 1984 part didn't register with me until now....
It's still the right way to go, you're just not quite done throwing money in the hole yet...

I think I have all the ESA parts locally as I'm pulling the 2.5 out of my 83 Tempest Bowrider- it's getting a V6 and I think I have another converter box from a full mechanical. But if you have ever thought about going to pertronix electronic ignition now is the time as you would need the CDI/Rapair ESA anyways....

 

[jontoronto27]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

I think I have all the ESA parts locally as I'm pulling the 2.5 out of my 83 Tempest Bowrider- it's getting a V6 and I think I have another converter box from a full mechanical. But if you have ever thought about going to pertronix electronic ignition now is the time as you would need the CDI/Rapair ESA anyways....

What the heck is an ESA? This outdrive looks exactly like the one I'm taking off it, still mechanical, not electric..and I'm not really sure what you mean about a Pertronix, I just put new points coils plugs and wires in it this spring. I took my old outdrive that pooched on me, the lower unit is draining right now, martian barf (by that mean very watery lube). and I took the shift cable off the unit and I can pull it and it spins freely so I think the lower is screwed yet again. See my avatar lol

 

[jontoronto27]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

Oh almost forgot, that guy you sent me the info for.. I've bought stuff off him before, got a thermostat and some gaskets for the tilt from him. Good guy. I think I'm going to get him to put the ball gears in it for me, well into the upper (don't have an arbor press) (also, do not know how to do it.)

 

[whywhyzed]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

ESA = Electronic Shift Assist, used on OMC drives from 1982-on. 1982 and newer drives have a different cut to the gears that prevents them from disengaging.
The ESA system stumbles the engines ignition system allowing it to release and return to Neutral. Without it functioning, you have to reef the shifter HARD, damaging cables and it's dangerous....especially if going to pick up a water skiier.

The 83 lower should look a tiny bit different as it will have a zinc anode behind the exhaust relief holes. A 1978 to 1981 lower unit was originally hydromechanical shift, not full-mechanical. In the lower is a little hydraulic pump that pumps gear lube and usues it to activate a servo assist cylinder.

#62 is the Zinc, and #65 is the bolt that holds it in -these identify a drive as full mechanical 1982-1985

The shifting will be backwards I think as well, if you were actually able to get the newer lower installed to the shift converter hsg., not 100% sure on that one.

 

[jontoronto27]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

ESA = Electronic Shift Assist, used on OMC drives from 1982-on. 1982 and newer drives have a different cut to the gears that prevents them from disengaging.
The ESA system stumbles the engines ignition system allowing it to release and return to Neutral. Without it functioning, you have to reef the shifter HARD, damaging cables and it's dangerous....especially if going to pick up a water skiier.
The 83 lower should look a tiny bit different as it will have a zinc anode behind the exhaust relief holes. A 1978 to 1981 lower unit was originally hydromechanical shift, not full-mechanical. In the lower is a little hydraulic pump that pumps gear lube and usues it to activate a servo assist cylinder.

oh boy. Does that mean I need a new control box and everything as well? How does an ESA wire in? is is like an ignition kill switch? I didn't know that part, but I think that explains now why it was a pain in the *** to shift in about out of gear after my outdrive was rebuilt. He told me he replaced the hydraulic pump with a mechanical set up, and that it would be easier to operate and faster. I'm trying to look up the ESA now and locate one.

 

[jontoronto27]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

Are you sure that's not for an 800? I can't find this ESA thing for anything but 8 Cyl Applications, and that diagram you are showing me is for an 800 as well.

 

[whywhyzed]

Re: Need people's advice on an 78 OMC Stringer

Are you sure that's not for an 800? I can't find this ESA thing for anything but 8 Cyl Applications, and that diagram you are showing me is for an 800 as well.

Yeah, must be just 800's- don't worry about it. I'm not really sure.