Rename Kindergarden?????

[TilliamWe]

Re: Rename Kindergarden?????

Yes, things are different. I still want to change kindergarden back to kindergarden.

Mark I am teasing you, so don't get crabby with me but...

Considering Kindergarten was never "kindergarden" if we change it "back to kindergarden" like you want, we have still changed the name!

4 year olds go to Kindergarten in NJ? It's for 5 year olds in Ohio, Florida, West Virginia, and Illinois. I guess some kids that don't turn 5 until October will be 4 when they start, but I can assure you, when my son turns 4 next July, they won't let him the doors that August. He will have to wait until August 2010, when he's 5 to start Kindergarten.

 

[cheburashka]

Re: Rename Kindergarden?????

This is more typical PC junk where we have to be careful not to offend everyone of every type of minor persuasion. We can't call Dec. 25 Christmas or put Christmas trees or nativities in public places or schools because it might offend someone but every other kind of symbol can be put up. Can't mention God, it might offend someone. Before long we won't be allowed to chant USA, display Old Glory or put our hands over out heart as it might be offensive!

Let's be fair about this. I'm as liberal as the day is long, and you'd probably consider me to be PC because I don't let my students say "retarded" or "colored" in my classrooms. However, the whole Kindergarten thing bugs me. I'm a descendant of Friedrich Froebel, the inventor of Kindergarten. He's probably rolling in his grave right now. A curriculum for Kindergarten? Tests? You can flunk Kindergarten? That's all completely wrong.

As for the rest of this post, suffice it to say that I completely disagree with what you're saying, but if I explained why, the thread would get political. Let's just say that the good old days in the classroom weren't as good for certain students who weren't part of the majority (and I was one of those students), and things have gotten a lot better for us over the years.

 

[KeyWestBoater]

Re: Rename Kindergarden?????

Let's be fair about this. I'm as liberal as the day is long, and you'd probably consider me to be PC because I don't let my students say "retarded" or "colored" in my classrooms.

Let's just say that the good old days in the classroom weren't as good for certain students who weren't part of the majority (and I was one of those students), and things have gotten a lot better for us over the years.

I agree that tagging someome with a negative name like "retarded" has no place in the classroom. Children have enough problems with self esteem and in believing in themselves without being torn down. Also, I do think that there are some special needs kids who need help and am thankful that there are programs to help them.

However, what I do disagree with is this renaming of things and disallowing of certain symbols for fear of being offensive to some group. This is just a pattern of progressively doing away with the freedom to express the things we believe in because it might be offensive.

 

[cheburashka]

Re: Rename Kindergarden?????

However, what I do disagree with is this renaming of things and disallowing of certain symbols for fear of being offensive to some group. This is just a pattern of progressively doing away with the freedom to express the things we believe in because it might be offensive.

It's the renaming things that I'm talking about. There was a time when it was OK to talk about "Negroes" in class, or to call a kid "retarded." They weren't "negative names." They were simply the language that was used at the time. Over the years, we've realized that these words have the power to hurt, and we've renamed these things. This has created a huge difference in how these folks are accepted by the rest of the classroom. This "political correctness" that you dislike so much has done away with names like "cripple" "retard" "Chinaman" and a host of other names which kept certain kids from fitting in. It's better now for them, and for other kids who don't need to be taught to judge other people by their external appearance or the ways that they're different from the average kid.

As for disallowing symbols, I'm wondering why anyone would think that children have a right to express what their parents believe in a public school classroom. That's not what public school is for. Cherish and protect your religious beliefs in the home, whether they're Christian, Jewish, Muslim, or something completely different. However, don't expect schools to support your beliefs over those of others. Schools are getting more diverse now, with lots of kids from other cultures. To keep things running smoothly in the schools, it's just a good idea to give up a bit of the way your family likes to celebrate. Otherwise, your kids don't end up celebrating somebody else's holiday three out of five days of the week.

In the end, does it really take anything away from you if the tree is called a "holiday tree" or your kid has to trek all the way down to the Murphy's house to see a real honest to goodness kresh? I don't think so.

 

[triumphrick]

Re: Rename Kindergarden?????

As for disallowing symbols, I'm wondering why anyone would think that children have a right to express what their parents believe in a public school classroom. To keep things running smoothly in the schools, it's just a good idea to give up a bit of the way your family likes to celebrate. Otherwise, your kids don't end up celebrating somebody else's holiday three out of five days of the week.

In the end, does it really take anything away from you if the tree is called a "holiday tree" or your kid has to trek all the way down to the Murphy's house to see a real honest to goodness kresh? I don't think so.

And all this garbage from a teacher in a public school system. What crap. Is this the thinking of his particular district, or is he interjecting his personal liberal agenda into our classrooms.

Well, I took a minute to view his personal profile, and it appears this poster is from the Pacific NW. Let's see, grow pot for personal use, same sex marriage, gays adopting children, can't pledge allegiance to the flag, can't pray in public, ......etc. etc. Yeah, I know the type. Thank God his like has set up in a state 3000 miles away from where I choose to live.

 

[KeyWestBoater]

Re: Rename Kindergarden?????

It's the renaming things that I'm talking about. There was a time when it was OK to talk about "Negroes" in class, or to call a kid a moron. Over the years, we've renamed these things and it has created a huge difference in how these folks are accepted by the rest of the classroom. This "political correctness" that you dislike so much has done away with names like "cripple" "retard" "Chinaman" and a host of other names which kept certain kids from fitting in. It's better now for them, and for other kids who don't need to be taught to judge other people by their external appearance or the ways that they're different from the average kid.

As for disallowing symbols, I'm wondering why anyone would think that children have a right to express what their parents believe in a public school classroom. That's not what public school is for. Cherish and protect your religious beliefs in the home, whether they're Christian, Jewish, Muslim, or something completely different. However, don't expect schools to support your beliefs over those of others. Schools are getting more diverse now, with lots of kids from other cultures. It's a good idea to give up a bit of what your family likes to celebrate, just so that your kids don't end up celebrating somebody else's holiday three out of five days of the week.

In the end, does it really take anything away from you if the tree is called a "holiday tree" or your kid has to trek all the way down to the Murphy's house to see a real honest to goodness kresh? I don't think so.

Please re-read my post. I said that I agree that tagging and name calling has no place in the classroom.

As for renaming and disallowing symbols, if you're going to disallow christian symbols then you must disallow all. I'm not saying that school or other organizations should support one belief above others. What I don't like is when symbols (i.e. christian) are disallowed but other (Islamic, Hindu, Jewish etc) ARE ALLOWED. After all we might offend one of those groups! No one worries about the double standard and offending those whose beliefs' symbols are discriminated against. I have seen time and time again where schools and other public entities allow all kinds of sysmbols but heaven forbid if someone displays a cross or something like that then it's not allowed.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Rename Kindergarden?????

I believe in most school districts Kindergarden is "optional". Your kid doesn't really have to start school until first grade. I'm wondering if the renaming has something to do with making it now required?

 

[scipper77]

Re: Rename Kindergarden?????

This thread has gotten way too political and I predict that it will be shut down very soon.

From what I've seen as soon as these type threads go from a discussion to an argument they get closed down pretty quickly. Please make points about the post topic and not the political views of the members of this site.

 

[wuttja]

Re: Rename Kindergarden?????

Personally, I don't understand the purpose of the name change. Kindergarten is what it is. Where I live in Wisconsin, we have K-4 which is 1/2 day Kindergarten for 4 year olds, then it is full day Kindergarten for the 5 year olds. Not only is the name change plain old silly, but it is costly to the taxpayers because now you have to pay for all the changes to anything printed or online that mentioned Kindergarten. Waste of time and money. I don't think this is a political thing, just typical local government making changes for the sake of change and not putting much forethought into the full impact. Important to attend those local meetings and stay involved. Make these groups give solid arguments about why change is needed. Sometimes it makes sense, but in many instances (like this one) it just doesn't.

 

[cheburashka]

Re: Rename Kindergarden?????

And all this garbage from a teacher in a public school system. What crap. Is this the thinking of his particular district, or is he interjecting his personal liberal agenda into our classrooms.

Well, I took a minute to view his personal profile, and it appears this poster is from the Pacific NW. Let's see, grow pot for personal use, same sex marriage, gays adopting children, can't pledge allegiance to the flag, can't pray in public, ......etc. etc. Yeah, I know the type. Thank God his like has set up in a state 3000 miles away from where I choose to live.

I won't be baited into uncivil behavior.

Since you've flown off the handle, I'll assume that you aren't capable of making your point through any reasonable means and have chosen instead to try to paint me with as broad a brush as you can. Nothing I wrote justified this kind of response, not even the fact that I'm liberal and you appear to detest liberals.

I'll tell you this much: Kindergarten was where I began to learn how to have polite conversation with people who are different from me. It appears that not everyone learned that lesson.

 

[cheburashka]

Re: Rename Kindergarden?????

Personally, I don't understand the purpose of the name change. Kindergarten is what it is. Where I live in Wisconsin, we have K-4 which is 1/2 day Kindergarten for 4 year olds, then it is full day Kindergarten for the 5 year olds. Not only is the name change plain old silly, but it is costly to the taxpayers because now you have to pay for all the changes to anything printed or online that mentioned Kindergarten. Waste of time and money. I don't think this is a political thing, just typical local government making changes for the sake of change and not putting much forethought into the full impact. Important to attend those local meetings and stay involved. Make these groups give solid arguments about why change is needed. Sometimes it makes sense, but in many instances (like this one) it just doesn't.

I agree that it's a bad idea to change the name, but I'm more worried about what that change represents. They're basically saying that Kindergarten is no longer distinct from the rest of the classes, and that justifies their adding more requirements to it. I'd like to know where they expect kids to learn the basic social skills they're going to need from first grade forward. I think what you call it has a lot to do with your philosophy of what it's for.

 

[cheburashka]

Re: Rename Kindergarden?????

Please re-read my post. I said that I agree that tagging and name calling has no place in the classroom.

As for renaming and disallowing symbols, if you're going to disallow christian symbols then you must disallow all. I'm not saying that school or other organizations should support one belief above others. What I don't like is when symbols (i.e. christian) are disallowed but other (Islamic, Hindu, Jewish etc) ARE ALLOWED. After all we might offend one of those groups! No one worries about the double standard and offending those whose beliefs' symbols are discriminated against. I have seen time and time again where schools and other public entities allow all kinds of sysmbols but heaven forbid if someone displays a cross or something like that then it's not allowed.

I agree with you on that. There's no justification for a school supporting one set of symbols and suppressing another. I've seen news stories about that kind of thing and it bothers me as well. In a class where students are studying comparitive religions, I'd expect equal time to be given to Christianity as well as Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam, Judaism, etc.

 

[Howard Sterndrive]

Re: Rename Kindergarden?????

In England it's "Nursery", which makes about as much sense as the German's "Kindergarden"....
sounds like kids are planted in soil to their knees and the teacher is watering them. Pre-first is ok. I'd prefer K-1
K-1,
1,
2,
etc...