Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC..UPDATE>>HELP!!

Ralphy

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I have a '96 48 HP Johnson. Replaced impeller and thermostat last weekend and took her out this morning for a lake run. Was a little on the cool side this morning (53*) and engine was a little hard to start (always started quick before). Once started it did not want to idle without the fast idle lever all the way up. Ordinarily with fast idle all the way up it revs +2000 rpm. Today with it up barely kept it at 1000. I let it run this way for at least 5 minutes. When I hit the primer switch it would kick up the rpm's for a moment then fall back down. I was finally able to back it off the trailer and after a couple of tries was able to kick into gear and head out. I gave it full throttle and it ran fine to my fishing hole and as I backed it off to idle in she shut down. Ok, fine, I dropped the trolling motor and went to work. Nothing happening here so decided to move to another spot. Cranked her up and same thing. Didn't want to idle, so I raised the fast idle lever and hit the primer switch. YIKES!!! It suddenly took off to 5000 rpm!! I turned off the key and pulled the kill switch but it ran on. I jumped to the back and disconnected the fuel line and prayed it would run out of gas before it threw shrapnel. It finally shut down so I took off the cowl for a look but saw nothing amiss. Ok, fishing is over for today so lets get back to the dock. I cranked it up once more, slammed it into gear and gave it full throttle. Took a couple of tries but finally got it to go and made it back to the nowake zone. With my hand on the key I put it in neutral and as soon as it hit neutral it started to take off again. I quickly turned off the key before it was able to get over 2500 rpm and she shut down. I used the trolling motor to get her loaded and took her home. I pulled both spark plugs and they were both a nice brown with a little gas/oil residue. I inspected the pistons and the top one was quite clean with just a little peppering of carbon. The bottom had a light coat of carbon over the whole surface. I have run seafoam on my last three tanks of gas (6 gallon tank). All hoses and wires look good. The only thing I removed when I did the impeller was the starter. Any ideas would be most appreciated. Thanks in advance.
 

tashasdaddy

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

had the same thing happen to my 88 spl. the jam nut on the linkage came loose allowing the trunion nut to turn throwing the link and sinc, out. i'm looking for a picture to show you. will be back.

MVC-813S.jpg


there should be a nut on the bolt that applies tension, so nothing moves. spin your trunion back some, and fire it up. then adjust it. to idle.
 

Ralphy

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Not it Tahasdaddy but sure got me going in the right direction...thanx. Ok here is pic of my carb linkage...note the cam follower (this is in neutral). It should be close to or touching the cam right? It seems to be stuck in this position.

CAM003.jpg
 
D

DJ

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Ralphy,

What all did you move/touch or unbolt when you replaced the impeller?

What happens, (under the hood) when you cycle through F-N-R on the controls-ENGINE OFF?

I'm trying to get a handle on why it would "run away" like that, especially after disabling the ignition.

Usually, the only way to disable the key and kill switch is by unplugging the big red plug, inside the cowl.
 

Ralphy

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Ok update...had motor tilted up and just went out and let it down. Jiggled the linkage, heard a little rattle and cam follower flipped back to cam...looks like something loose inside. Next step is pulling the airsilencer off and having a looksee. Can I reuse the gaskets or will I need to order new ones?
 

rickdb1boat

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Check the timer base under the flywheel. It sounds like it may be sticking....Can you move it back and forth smoothly?
 

F_R

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Don't know if this will help, but look out! The motor may be in the process of swallowing something that got stuck in the throttle plate, holding it open. Now that it's out and the throttle plate snapped back, the "something" is free to go deeper into the motor's innards. Could spell disaster if it gets inside.
 

Ralphy

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

That is my worst nightmare F_R...I thought of that and was wondering if anyone might have any idea of what might have come loose that I should look for?
 

F_R

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

My guess would be one of the fasteners that hold the air silencer base to the carburetors.
 
D

DJ

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

That still doesn't explain why the key or kill switch wouldn't kill it.
 

ezeke

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

I would guess that your fuel pump either has a split membrane, or it is not mounted tightly.

The remaining carbon in the firing chambers is the most likely reason for the continuing combustion.
 
D

DJ

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

ezeke said:
I would guess that your fuel pump either has a split membrane, or it is not mounted tightly.

The remaining carbon in the firing chambers is the most likely reason for the continuing combustion.

That would make sense.
 

Silvertip

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

If the engine has any amount of carbon in it, high revs, and a throttle plate partially open will cause it to run away with no spark. Even if there is no spark, at high rpm fuel and air can still be drawn into the engine and it can be ignited by glowing carbon deposits. You should see what happens when a turbocharger springs an oil leak on a large diesel generator engine engine. I did see a picture of one that ran away. The crankcase split into many pieces and the crankshaft rolled out an overhead door in pieces with multiple pieces hanging off it.
 
D

DJ

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC

Silvertip,

Thanks, I kind though that is where you were going. I guess the owner stating he decarbed it threw me.

I have indeed seen a 6-71 run away. We were told, in my diesel training, to always "run parallel to the crankshaft", from a Detroit.:^
 

Ralphy

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC UPDATE>>>HELP!!

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC UPDATE>>>HELP!!

Ok took off the airsilencer box and here is what I found. One of the throttle plate screws on the top carb was gone and the other one was about 3/4 turn away from going too. This allowed the throttle plate to slip down locking the throttle pretty much in wide open position. No telling how long the one screw has been missing. So what do I do now? Is the missing screw going to leave me "screwed"?
 

ezeke

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC..UPDATE>>HELP!!

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC..UPDATE>>HELP!!

You will want to find the screw - It may have been pulled into the intake manifold. Be sure to use thread locker.
 

Ralphy

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC..UPDATE>>HELP!!

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC..UPDATE>>HELP!!

Ok and how would you suggest I find the screw...are you talking a complete engine dismantle?
 

ezeke

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC..UPDATE>>HELP!!

Hopefully, it would be stopped by the leaf plates in the intake manifold.
 

tashasdaddy

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC..UPDATE>>HELP!!

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC..UPDATE>>HELP!!

remove the carbs, investigate with a dental type mirror, if no go , remove the intake manifold assembly. the screw didn't fall out of the engine. don't run. till you find it.
 

Ralphy

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Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC..UPDATE>>HELP!!

Re: Runaway Revs!! J48ESLEDC..UPDATE>>HELP!!

WOOHOO found it. Was lodged in the corner of outside chamber and was able to get to it with tweezers. Will reassemble with locktite and take of lower carb and do the same. Thanks for all the help gents. Should be good to go from here.
 
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