Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

[Dualie]

when i fire up the engine I am getting a lot of smoke, way more than it should and it runs really rough. takes more than twice to start.

people are telling me to swap out the water/fuel separator and take a look at the plugs to see if they are fouled out.

anything else i should check?

would really hate to pull it out and bring it to the dealer.

your expertise is needed- thanks in advance!!

-Dualie

 

[sleepinin]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

Dualie,
I'd also change the fuel filter under the cowling, rebuild the fuel Pump, replace anti-siphon valve on the fuel tank(clean the screen while your there), check the air vent on the fuel tank, and check the spark on all cylinders to see that you get a 7/16" or 1/2 jump (blue color). If that doesn't work might start looking at cleaning the carbs.

 

[andy6374]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

Welcome to the world of carb'd two strokes. When they start up they smoke it up.

Does it run well after it warms up? Are you giving it some throttle (in neutral that is) while it is warming up.
What's your starting procedure?

Does it run well after it's warmed up?

No need to rebuild the fuel pump, change out anti-syphon valve..etc.
We don't even know if you have a problem yet.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

Do you have recent compression results?
That and the spark test are the first two things.
Make a note of spark plug appearance - they should all look pretty much the same, any difference note which hole they came from.
If the fuel line sucks air, the pump will cycle faster, which makes it pump more oil, which makes more smoke.

So, inspect all the fuel lines replace if they're getting old. Listen close when you pump the primer bulb sometimes you can hear if a fitting is sucking air.

 

[Dualie]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

Do you have recent compression results?
That and the spark test are the first two things.
Make a note of spark plug appearance - they should all look pretty much the same, any difference note which hole they came from.
If the fuel line sucks air, the pump will cycle faster, which makes it pump more oil, which makes more smoke.

So, inspect all the fuel lines replace if they're getting old. Listen close when you pump the primer bulb sometimes you can hear if a fitting is sucking air.

 

[phatmanmike]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

seriously.... i have the same motor. mine is 1994 though.

they smoke. thats what they do. its GOOD that it smokes. if it ever STOPS smoking, thats when you have a serious problem.

its ALWASY gonna smoke alot at start up. especially since your alsways sitting still and the smoke os more noticeable.

i decarbed mine and then switched to 100% synthetic oil. smoke wenta way a WHOLE bunch. almost not even noticable.

no need for compression checks and such because you say it smokes atstart up. its a 2 stroke.

 

[Dualie]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

Great insight- I will try to answer everyone's questions. i just noticed an error in my post- I have a 1989 Merc Black Max 200, not 1996.!!!

Lieutanent Junior Grade,
Starting procedures:
squeeze bulb until firm, put throttle in (N) and push all the way forward to full, push erincher for a few seconds and then turn to start. once it fires up, i quickly pull throttle back to (N) and let idle for a few mins. smoke goes away and runs/sounds good.
usually, fires up on 1st or 2nd try.

Something is definitely wrong. Takes too many tries to get it running- each shot at the above creates a ton of smoke. Much more than I am used to seeing and comfortable with.

Rear Admiral,
Last summer I had the engine tuned by the dealer and had a compression check on all cylinders before I bought it. Everything checked out ok.
Compression results were the following:
1)125
2)130
3)135
4)125
5)125
6)125

They also preformed a cyclinder drop test and it performed well. Ran last season with no issues. Ran well beginning of this season.

Starting having issues at 3/8 tank of gas. NOTE: LAST YEARS GAS w/stabil.

Yesterday, I replaced the water/fuel separator and didn't notice any junk in the bowl- but swapped it anyways.

Note- the fuel in the bowl was purple-ish in color. Is that normal?

Going to check all the plugs today and replace if necessary.

Also, replaced the fuel line with bulb primer this spring.

Thanks so much and will post my findings later today.
-Dualie

 

[gss036]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

I don't think you need to have the throttle to full to start it up. Just in nuetral and maybe a little on the throttle and press the key in to activate the enrichner. I think the only time you would want full throttle is if you think it is flooded.
Like the above posts says, it is going to smoke on start up. That is because when you shut it down there is a gas/oil mixture in the carbs and you will have some gas evaportation and more avalible oil to burn off. I sometimes have to try 2-3 times before my 200 starts. I do not run the starter for long periods of time, maybe 10-15 seconds.
Really doesn't sound like you have a problem.

 

[Dualie]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

Lieutanent Junior Grade et al,
the guy who i bought the boat from told me to full throttle before I turn the key.
so tomorrow, i will try neutral and a little of throttle but not full.
also, i swapped all the plugs today- the old ones were black and oily. after i tried starting it up with a lot of effort- a good twenty minutes of enriching, jerking the throttle backing and forth. finally, it ran. i let it idle for about 40 minutes. killed and started it again with no problems. smokey, but seemed a bit less.

perhaps, the last years fuel needs to be drained out and new E10 fuel should be added??

is it normal to have purple-ish fuel? i saw this when i removed the water/fuel separator. the engine is oil-injected.

thanks so much - dualie

 

[gss036]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

Go SeaHawks!
Duealie,
1. Do Not Use E10 fuel unless you absolutely have to. If you do, check your new filter after afew hours to see how much junk had been cleaned out of the gas tank from the alcohol. If you start smelling gas after using E10, check you fuel lines for softening or seeping at connections.
2. I have never seen purple fuel unless it has some kind of additive in it.(?) Maybe Mystery Oil, it is red??
3. Yes, last years fuel needs to be removed or a lot of new fuel added, depending on the size of you gas tank(how many gallons?).
4. Personally, I would not idle a carbed 2stroke for that long, it will just foul your plugs and build up carbon. After you get things figured out, sounds like it is time for a decarb, check FAQ for procedures.

 

[phatmanmike]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

outboard oil is colored, some purple, some blue, some green. so yes, your fuel will be colored from the oil. normal.


plugs will look black and oily, normal again.

you can idle a carbed 2 stroke all freekin day long. no worries.

your rig sounds like its in great shape. start it in nuetral and let us know what your idle rpms are. should be about 700 ish in gear and maybe 900 ish in nuetral

 

[jtexas]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

My fuel is always purplish because I pre-mix.

phatmanmike will know better than me, but...The oil is mixed by the pump...so there shouldn't be any oil in the water separator or tank unless it was premixed. There's a couple good reasons to premix an oil-injected engine - break-in following engine rebuild, or not sure pump is operating correctly. You might try to monitor the oil useage compared to gas useage.

Mike, isn't there a check valve to prevent oily gas from draining back into the tank when the engine's turned off?

Premixed fuel plus oil injection will increase the smoke output. So will cold weather and cold engine.

A light coating of oil on the plugs after idling a long time is good. Carbon build-up isn't.

If you have to use E-10, do definately drain the old gas first - and clean out the tank best you can, the General Boating Topics forum is probably best place for how-to on that.

 

[gss036]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

I guess opinions are like noses, we all have one :-}.
After thinking about the above, I have come to conclusion, maybe wrong, but at any rate, Dualie, you bought this boat and motor and this is your 1st few times running and you are running the fuel that was in your boat when you bought it,yes/no? I bet the previous owner pre-mixed before you took possession. Other wise how are you getting purple colored oil in the fuel filter? Oil injection injects oil at the engine after the filters.
How much stabil was put in the oil?
Maybe it is time to rebuild the fuel pump.
Again I don't think you have a problem, go have some fun.

 

[PuddleJumper]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

If enough Sta-Bil was mixed in the gas it would color it.
If there was pre mix in tank You should make sure the oil injection is working before adding straight gas to tank.

OBTW I have a 1990 200 (When cold) I usually use approx 1/4 to 1/3 throttle and I hold key (choke/enrich) in until start. Works every time for past 16 yearsd

 

[Dualie]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

If enough Sta-Bil was mixed in the gas it would color it.
If there was pre mix in tank You should make sure the oil injection is working before adding straight gas to tank.

OBTW I have a 1990 200 (When cold) I usually use approx 1/4 to 1/3 throttle and I hold key (choke/enrich) in until start. Works every time for past 16 yearsd

 

[Dualie]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1989 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1989 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

Lieutanant Junior Grade, Rear Admiral, Captian and Puddle Jumper,
thanks again in advance for helping me troubleshoot this issue(s).

the boat is 20' CC with no premixing needed. gas in one end & 2 stroke oil in the other container which is fed directly to the engine.
I have a 66 gallon alluminum tank- not accessible b/c it is under the helm. Fuel/water sep. next to engine.
the oil-injector is working as i have less than a 1/2 tank of oil in the reserve container.

i bought the boat last summer, used it all summer, filled up with regualr gas and bought more two-stroke oil and continued to motor until fall when i pulled it out. no issues- lots of fun!

Stabil was added last fall (2005) before the man winterized the engine and wrapped it for the winter. i had 3/4 tank of fuel so a couple of capfulls were put in by the winterizing guy. ( i know how to do it myself now, no more payin the man! )

unfortunaely, E10 is here and is staying. i live in MA. we were one of the last folks to get the ethanol standard. no going back now.

Will post results later today- re: starting in N. I think i will pump out some more fuel into a bucket and see if it is still purpleish after it has ran for a bit. we will see if it backs up or not.

maybe i should name the boat "cross your fingers"
thanks again - stef

 

[gss036]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

Dualie, a couple of caps full of stay-bil is not nearly enough for 40 gallons, I would think maybe a pint.
When I started out this summer, I added a qt of Mystery Oil to 100 gallons of gas and it has ran great, although I'm on my 3rd tank of gas now. I usually use Starbrite but had the Mystery Oil sitting in the shop at the time.
Sounds like you have things under control.

 

[Dualie]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1989 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1989 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

perhaps you are correct. probably not enough stabil last year and the fuel is souring every day now.

next step: pump out the remaining fuel and fill her up?? what do you think?

OR

keep the old and fill her up with the fresh stuff. i am at 3/8 to 1/2 of tank currently.

one more thing- i could not beleive my eyes when it started lastnight when the throttle was just a 1/4 above Neutral.
perhaps, i have been flooding it since the get go!!!

Dualie

 

[jrbachman]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

My old mans boat had last years gas It look dark like tea but didnt smell anything like gas. I have read about different colored dyes used to mark gas whether taxes have been paid on them or not.I remember purple being on of the colors. If the engine runs decent enough I would burn as much of it as possible before filling up with e10.Then after a short run period change all filters since the alcohol will dissolve scum in the tank,lines and carbs.I recently did my boat and the old mans boat this way and have had no problems. One more thing I did was add seafoam with the new gas.

 

[jsr21]

Re: Running rich?? Newbie here - 1996 merc 200hp 2-stroke O/B

when i fire up the engine I am getting a lot of smoke, way more than it should and it runs really rough. takes more than twice to start.

people are telling me to swap out the water/fuel separator and take a look at the plugs to see if they are fouled out.

anything else i should check?

would really hate to pull it out and bring it to the dealer.

your expertise is needed- thanks in advance!!

-Dualie

I had a similar problem with my 1995 merc 225. It would smoke extremely bad and would be next to impossible to start if it sat for more than a few hours. Once I got it running, it would fire right back up if it was 5 or 10 minutes...but if left for a few hours or more, it was brutal. Turned out I had to replace the check valve in the side of the block that pressurizes the oil tank(the small one on the motor). The valve is supposed to release the pressure from the tank after shut down so it doesn't keep trying to pump pure oil into the carbs. My carbs would be full of really oil rich fuel, thus making it near impossible to start and smoke like a building on fire when I finally got it going. I replaced the check valve, about $20, and problem cured...hope this helps you out.