Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

[SeaKaye12]

Hi,<br /><br />Many of you know that California is slowly legislating the phase out of 2 Stroke engines; not only on boats and personal watercraft, but also on lawn mowers and string trimmers and the like.<br /><br />Lake Tahoe and surrounding lakes in the Tahoe Basin have gone ahead and banned the use of carbureted two-stroke engines altogether. In other parts of the state the engines already in the hands of consumers are still allowed; but for how long?<br /><br />Here's a picture taken at a marina at a Southern California lake. They have replaced their rental fleet with 4-strokes, and have purposely disabled their old 2-stroke engines so they are effectively taken off the market.<br /><br />This particular lake is a drinking water reservoir...no body contact sports allowed; so the purity of the water is of top priority.<br />

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<br /><br />Note the hole knocked ito the crankcase. There's another hole in the lower unit housing...making the motors beyond redemption except for a few parts here and there.<br /><br />Something I find interesting, so I thought I'd pass it along,<br /><br />Chuck

 

[tommays]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

its hard to believe there was not money involved to keep these motors off the resale market<br /><br />theres way to much laying there to just throw away<br /><br />tommays

 

[CATransplant]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

That blows! I hate that kind of wastefulness. If nothing else, there is a huge need for outboards in the third world. <br /><br />Now I know why I left California.

 

[briannh1234]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

There worrying about the drinkability of the water. Funny thing is the 2 stroke oil that would wind up in the lake just floats on the top of the water anyhow. It would be EZ to seperate the water from the oil - just take it from the bottom of the lake.<br /><br />From the looks of the lower units it's not that clean a lake anyway.<br /><br />Does anyone know of any part of the "envioronment" that will be less polluted because of these laws? Or are these laws just going to sell more outboards and make people scrap there perfectly good motors? Anyone?

 

[jim dozier]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

Actually Brianh1234, as someone who works in water resources I have to say your comment is not entirely true. While we oftern speak of "oil and water don't mix" that is not entirely true. Oil has a low solubility in water but is not completely insoluble. "Oil" is not just 1 chemical it is a mixture of multiple chemicals some of which are more soluble in water than others. Same with gasoline. While gasoline is oil based and has a relatively low solubility in water, some of the components (of which there are many) are more water soluble such as benzene and MTBE. Unburned hydrocarbons from internal combustion engines or hydrocarbons spilled from gas tanks or leaking from storage tanks don't just float on the water, some of it gets dissolved in it.

 

[K Hultgre]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

one word, <br />Marine-Tex<br /><br />Why could they not sell them on e-bay or similar and ship them out of CA ????????

 

[lakelover]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

I've asked this question in another post, but...Where are the Mercury 2-strokes? I just looked on their website and all they have listed is 4-strokes?<br /><br /> Mercury <br /><br />I was out in the wilds on vacation for a couple weeks, but I couldn't have been gone that long?

 

[LubeDude]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

Many people get there water out of the Lake I live on, it has watersports of every kind all year long, even though there are floating toilets, the Bass fisherment continue to P**ss in the lake on a regular basis. Knowbody has died or even gotten sick. The Government makes you put a certain % of chemicals in the water whether it needs it or not.<br /><br />Hey, Im as much for clean water as anyone, but lets get real.<br /><br />Just a bunch of senseless crap from the Do Gooders.

 

[DJ]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

Banning 2-stokes is pure government farse. Until California (CARB) wakes up and bans MTBE (fuel additive), nobody will benefit.<br /><br />Typical government "show" over substance.

 

[seahorse5]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

There is a lot of misinformation floating around the media and the internet about 2-strokes.<br /><br />Keep in mind that any new motor can be sold in California as long as it meets EPA 2006 (CARB 2001) emission output. All DFI 2-strokes and most 4-strokes meet this requirement. If a carbureted 2-stroke could meet the spec, it too would be legal.<br /><br />If I remember correctly, there are only about 11 bodies of water in CA that have emission output restrictions like Lake Tahoe does.<br /><br />Traditional 2-strokes are still allowed to be used and sold in California except in the 11 or so waters mentioned above.

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

According to CARB rules, no new engine that does not meet whatever their current standard is, can be shipped into California by a dealer or manufacturer. Consumers buy and ship them to neighboring states and then have friends and relatives ship them into California. So, if you can get one across state lines you can use it...except in those few bodies of water where they are regulated.<br /><br />Also, I think that rental fleet received a state grant to switch to four-stroke...if they destroyed the 2-strokes. The Tree Huggers wanted to make sure they would not be re-introduced back to the consumer.

 

[John McFarlane]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

I think Jimd says it all.<br />Whilst I sympathise with all who use motorised vessels on public waterways (and I am one of them), we need to start doing something about the amount of crap that is going into our water, not just inland but into the sea as well. (And don't get me started on what we pump into our air!!!)<br /><br />It's getting so bad that a lot of the fish we catch cannot be eaten, due to pesticide, herbicide and heavy metal contamination.<br /><br />And provided that the Govt has done it's research, and consulted with appropriate and relevant bodies, then they have the well being of the majority (hopefully) and the future in sight.<br /><br />We need to stop being so shortsighted about the future of this planet, and being so cocooned in our own little world to the detriment of those around us and those that will come after us.<br /><br />Yes, you're right, it is such a shame to see all those motors being discarded. But get over it. It's our children who may die from something they drank in the water when Grandaddy used to go boating on the lake with his smelly,oily, smokey 12 foot tinny.<br /><br />No I'm not a 'tree hugger'. Just a realist who has 2 young children.<br /><br />Not sorry about yet another rant

 

[Joey One]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

Just the facts,mam.<br />There are no California state restrictions on 2-strokes; nor are there plans to restrict any outboards.<br />Local agencies have placed some outboard restrictions on 7 of our many lakes.<br />There are some lakes where no motors of any kind are allowed; and there are some drinking water lakes where no access is permitted. I would guess many states have similar restrictions.

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

C.A.R.B is California Air Resources Board....and they do restrict the transportation into California of all new, carburetored, 2-strokes and the sale into California of any engine that does not meet the set minimum of emmisions.<br /><br /> Also, there has never been any proof offered by CARB or the EPA as to any damage caused to the environment by outboard engines....ZERO. Outboards are an insignificant pollution source in terms of impact. There is more damage done to lakes by rainwater runoff in one hour than is done in a year by outboards. Government boards and agencys justify their own existence, sometimes, with "feel good" measures. Restrictions on outboards qualify as a "feel good" measure. It's sort of like handing a fly swatter to a guy at a garbage dump and telling him that that he can swat every fly that lands on his left knee, but he is not allowed to swat one anywhere else. Is he making a difference to the fly problem? The environment will not be effected, either in a positive or negative way, by outboards.

 

[ZmOz]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

Banning new 2 strokes is one thing. Destroying current ones is just stupid. What is the environmental cost of disposing of that outboard, and creating another 4 stroke to replace it? I'd bet alot of money it's more than any amount of pollution that 2 stroke could make. <br /><br />Who else thinks we just need to give california back to mexico?

 

[seahorse5]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

Originally posted by Joey One:<br /> Just the facts,mam.<br />There are no California state restrictions on 2-strokes; nor are there plans to restrict any outboards. <br /><br /><br />Here is the official word:<br /><br /> http://dbw.ca.gov/TwoStroke/TSxp.asp

 

[briannh1234]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

I'm all for saving the environment. But I think there are bigger poluters of the environment than outboard motors out there.<br /><br />I'm also for the increased efi of the new motor designs, which means less gas burned therefore less air polution. But those old motors would have terminally died someday and would then need to be replaced by the newly designed motors.<br /><br />Benzene and MTBE come from the gas, not the oil, so your not saving any water there.<br /><br />Pesticides, herbasides, and heavy metal contamination are not caused by 2 stroke outboard motors so again you not saving any water either.<br /><br />I boat on a lake in Maine that's been used for watersports of all kinds for probably close to 100 years. The water is still known for it's clarity. It's safe to drink, but like I said skip the first few feet of water, may have some oil in it.<br /><br />I guess that oil does wind up somewhere?

 

[stan_deezy]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

Unbelievable!!!<br /><br />What the heck is the point of punching holes in these engines?<br /><br />Here's a question that the loony-left and the tree-huggers may want to consider before they massacre another set of engines:<br /><br />"What are you going to do with the heavy metals that are left in the pile of scrap motors?"<br /><br />Put them in a landfill site and then let the rainwater leech the heavy metals out and into the water table?<br /><br />Sink them at sea and let the seawater leech the heavy metals out and into the fish/marine life?<br /><br />As for a shortage of engines in the third world: what about everywhere else in the world? I'd have gladly paid shipping on one of those engines. Just think: the project could have been self funding: give a grant to the rental fleet to replace the engines: export them at the buyers expense to the UK and Europe and recoup the grant money from the sale of these engines?<br /><br />I'd have bought the lot and had them shipped them over here.<br /><br />My biggest worry is that whatever happens in the US today happens in the UK soon after.......<br /><br />May the planet protect us from the misguided environmentalists.........(bro steps down from his soapbox and goes for an environmentally friendly beer and a lie down)

 

[BillP]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

Rant here...The treehuggers don't have time to worry about disposal on the old motors. They are too busy chopping down trees to build their new houses on...with big garages to park their gas guzzling SUVs in. Then their time is spent going to zoning meetings to stop everyone else from chopping down trees and building houses with garages. It's called the "I've got mine but you can't have it too" syndrome.

 

[jurgenscraft]

Re: Sad Fate for these Two-Strokes (Pics Included)

This can only happen in America. here in Africa some people have to do one hell of a lot of saving and skimping to buy one of those motors before they were wrecked,some of the African people do not earn the cost of a new 60hp motor in a life time, there is is a shortage of low cost second hand motors, for subsistance fishing and river transport, what a pity is all I can say,<br />Kind Regards William Wright.