Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run (fixed)

[alden135]

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrr,

J120TLES

Engine will only start 1 in 20 tries. When it does start, it will run a short period and then die. If I increase the idle lever it will run a little longer but will die on it's own or will die if I cut throttle back.

It will be easier to list what parts are not new:

Not new
Stator
Reg/Rect.
Engine internals

That's it.

This engine which is supposed to be one of OMC's finest is one week away from the breakers if it refuses to run right.

 

[Walker]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Compression, spark, fuel.
One of them is lacking. Which one??

 

[AlanR]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Sounds like a plugged carb. Clean ur carbs and you should be in a better way. d

 

[evil grady]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

What type of trouble shooting have you done?

 

[Rudy Brown]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

I'll buy it from you. d

 

[alden135]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Compression, spark, fuel.
One of them is lacking. Which one??

It's driving me friggin nuts because it has all 3

 

[OBJ]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Alden, it's has all three but it's running out of one which sounds like fuel or on the other hand, maybe getting to much fuel. The fact that you raise the warm up lever and it runs a little longer kind of proves that point.

If you push in the choke, will this keep it running or cause it to "bog" out? Have you squeezed the primer bulb and did it make a difference?

Do you still have the VRO(OMS) pump?

Sorry for all the questions but we need a place to start.

 

[alden135]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Alden, it's has all three but it's running out of one which sounds like fuel or on the other hand, maybe getting to much fuel. The fact that you raise the warm up lever and it runs a little longer kind of proves that point.

If you push in the choke, will this keep it running or cause it to "bog" out? Have you squeezed the primer bulb and did it make a difference?

Do you still have the VRO(OMS) pump?

Sorry for all the questions but we need a place to start.

Hi OBJ,

Everything was running great till 3 weeks ago. The trim motor went again. I replaced it and then the VRO pump crapped out. I pressure tersted it, found a crack in the air motor housing, and then replaced it with a fuel only pump.

I link/sync'd the thing again to make sure that was all ok.

I pulled the flywheel to look for a fried stator.

I've tried the choke and squeezed the bulb, makes no difference.

I know the old fuel pump was bad, but am thinking something else was causing my problems. I am at the ned of my rope and my wallet hurts. All my ign. parts are new except what I listed.

I'm really starting to think I have a lemon.

Whats my reg/rect supposed to look like? Mine looks like it's filled with rock salt. Is that normal?

Also, I only have 12.4 volts at the battery when idling.

 

[OBJ]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

When you replaced the fuel pump (VRO) with a standard fuel pump, did it connect to the side of the block for pulses or did you use the old pulse line for the VRO? If you used the old pulse line, did you remove the pulse limiter?

You probably won't see full charging voltage until you get to aroun 4500 to 5000rpm. This is when most full output from the charge system occures....there abouts.

Not sure about the rock salt...d

 

[evil grady]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

" If you used the old pulse line, did you remove the pulse limiter?"

OBJ,
What does the pulse limiter look like? Should the pulse hose go straight from the pump to the block?

Whats a max RPM for a 120 looper?

 

[alden135]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

[quote time1153145493= userOBJ= uid18214= fid28= tid= rid8= When you replaced the fuel pump VRO() with a standard fuel pump, did it connect to the side of the block for pulses or did you use the old pulse line for the VRO? If you used the old pulse line, did you remove the pulse limiter?

You probably won't see full charging voltage until you aroun 4500 aroun 5000rpm to 5000rpm. This is when most full output from the occuresthere system occures....there abouts.

Not saltd about the rock salt...d[/quote]



I used the pump that looks just like the VRO2 with the exception of the oil side and circutry. It came with the updated (blue) pulse limiter and hooks up where the old pulse line was.

 

[OBJ]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

OK....you replaced the VRO with the replacement fuel pump only.....that's the one that looks like the VRO but only pumps gas.....right? BOMBY calls it the "Pre mix Conversion Kit". Then you should use the pulse limiter of course.....blue side pointing toward the engine.

Back to the problem......it is, of course, possible you may have gotten a bad pump.....happens on occasion.

Does your engine have two or four carbs? I don't know the year. Well, anyway.....working with the fuel problem, shoot the carbs with some premix just before starting and see if that makes a difference at starting and keeping the engine running. Maybe I'm running a blind alley here Alden but if you got a hot spark across a 1/2" gap and your compression is up.....leaves fuel.

Any chance you could have gotten a good slug of junk in the carbs.....like dirt or something from the old pump?

 

[alden135]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

OK....you replaced the VRO with the replacement fuel pump only.....that's the one that looks like the VRO but only pumps gas.....right? BOMBY calls it the "Pre mix Conversion Kit". Then you should use the pulse limiter of course.....blue side pointing toward the engine.

Back to the problem......it is, of course, possible you may have gotten a bad pump.....happens on occasion.

Does your engine have two or four carbs? I don't know the year. Well, anyway.....working with the fuel problem, shoot the carbs with some premix just before starting and see if that makes a difference at starting and keeping the engine running. Maybe I'm running a blind alley here Alden but if you got a hot spark across a 1/2" gap and your compression is up.....leaves fuel.

Any chance you could have gotten a good slug of junk in the carbs.....like dirt or something from the old pump?

I have 2 dual throat carbs. I guess it's possible they're clogged. There's plenty of gas in the water when I'm trying to start it though and the plugs have fuel on them. ( My last ride before breakdown produced a lot of carbon on the plugs and inside the VRO2 air motor housing)

How I can have fuel, spark and compression and no run is a mystery to me.

 

[Pony]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

just thining aloud here............but.....its not flooding right, like a float stuck open? It would xplain the difficulty to start.......the wet plugs.....the bogging down.

Hopefully you get this sorted out...........Have you tried spinning it plugs out after it bogs to clear the cylinders, and drying the plugs?

 

[OBJ]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Or, your sucking in to much fuel and not enough air which would cause the sheen on the water and heavy carbon. I would, just for grins, take the cover off the carbs and check the throttle plates are closed when the control is in neutral.

Just a thought also, make sure the primer solenoids red handle is pointing to the bottom of the solenoid and that your not pumping extra gas into the engine while running from the primer. Easy to do, just pull the primer line off the top carb and squeeze the primer ball. If you get fuel from the primer line, your problem is in the primer.

 

[ezeke]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

2 dual throated carbs?

 

[OBJ]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Sure ezeke.....upper carb feeds #1&2....lower #3&4.

It's like two carbs stuck together with one float. Each throat has it's own high speed and low speed jet as well as idle air jet.

 

[ezeke]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Sorry, I thought this was a 1990 looper model J120TLES.

Nothing like that in the Parts Manual that I looked at."http://epc.brp.com/login.aspx?ReturnUrl=%2fdefault.aspx%3fbrands%3dej%26lang%3dE&brands=ej&lang=E"

 

[alden135]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Ezeke, There are 4 floats. I only said 2 dual throat carbs because there was a big arguement last year about how many carbs there are and what I should call them. All I know is I put in 4 kits and there were 4 floats.

 

[ezeke]

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

Re: Screwed Again Looper 120 won't run

No kidding.