Starting hard Force 125

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shakazulu

Seaman
Joined
May 16, 2011
Messages
67
My force has problem with starting . It seems that I can not start it if it is in the water. Only when I trim it out and water leaks out from the leg it starts but also hard, never on first crank . I have to crank it with maximum throttle when not in gear ( this throttle is out of gear only cca 2000 rpm) . Then I trim it down to the water. After I trim down you need to wait for 5-10 seconds till water goes again through it and the bubbles start from exhaust . After that I can reduce the throttle and it works on idle but also dies sometimes because of weak idle. In idle it misses and spits fuel every few seconds on lower carb. If it dies I have to trim out again, wait till water leaks from the system and crank it again. Sometimes even 5-6 times. What could be the reason of hard starting? Timing is good, spark on all cylinders good, compression good.
 
jerryjerry05

jerryjerry05

Supreme Mariner
Joined
May 7, 2008
Messages
18,075
Re: Starting hard Force 125

Check the fuel pump diaphram.Then clean the carbs and while they are off check the reeds.
Once it's running what's the rpm in neutral and in gear.Out of the wayer and in the water.
What's the comp readings?
Are the plugs all burning the same?
 
B

bentle

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Aug 2, 2011
Messages
492
Re: Starting hard Force 125

Your pix were invalid so can't help you with that. Go to boats.net, select force chrysler outboards, then select engine year & hp. From here you will need model serial number then select. Should bring up a list of options to choose from. Select fuel pump and you should get a parts break down and be able to select your part number or match them up with ebay kits.
 
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bentle

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Aug 2, 2011
Messages
492
Re: Starting hard Force 125

Nice job on the pix. Yes I would say a diaphragm is in order here. I don't think that either of the parts you are looking at will work for your motor thought. Do like I suggested though. Go to boats.net and find it there. You can even try to search the iboats store as well. Im not 100% sure about the ebay parts though so that's why im suggesting to look up your part numbers along without your motors model serial # to be sure.
 
S

shakazulu

Seaman
Joined
May 16, 2011
Messages
67
Re: Starting hard Force 125

I checked some different serial numbers of Force 125 89. and it seems that all of them have the same parts for fule pump kit ( diaphragm, gaskets ) . But on Boats.net it says To comply with Mercury policy, Boats.net will not ship OEM Mercury parts outside of the United States. So I can not order to Europe .
Ebay is much simplier for me . So which of the items on ebay you would suggest? One has this round plastic gasket and maybe I don't need it , I found it in good shape. Thank you for help .
 
B

bentle

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Aug 2, 2011
Messages
492
Re: Starting hard Force 125

Im thinking that your fuel pump is a little different than the kind we use here in the states. On one side of your pump diaphragm I see a metal round thing and im just not familiar with that. Jerry or fukawi a little help here if you could please. Thanks. Frank?
 
S

shakazulu

Seaman
Joined
May 16, 2011
Messages
67
Re: Starting hard Force 125

The metal thing is not connected to the diaphragm, it is just staying on it and pressing it together with the spring. It is between spring and diaphragm and they together push the diaphragm in. Boat was imported from Germany to my country Croatia 2002.
 
J

Jiggz

Captain
Joined
Oct 23, 2009
Messages
3,909
Re: Starting hard Force 125

The $8.89 kits seems to be the better fit for you fuel pump. For less than $11.00 it's a good gamble to choose this one over the other one. The diaphragm part number F438747 is the one listed on Boats.net which is the same one listed on this ebay listing.
 
S

shakazulu

Seaman
Joined
May 16, 2011
Messages
67
Re: Starting hard Force 125

Yes, I desided for $8,89 kit and probably it will arrive in 10-15 days and I will install new diaphragm. Then I will see is this the only problem for hard starting. I didn't find any other defective parts
 
S

shakazulu

Seaman
Joined
May 16, 2011
Messages
67
Re: Starting hard Force 125

One more thing that I am considering is replacing electric fuel pump between tank and motor with simple primer bulb. Sometimes I think that electric pump pumps too much fuel pressure
 
jerryjerry05

jerryjerry05

Supreme Mariner
Joined
May 7, 2008
Messages
18,075
Re: Starting hard Force 125

The first kit for $8. is the one to get.It has all the necessary gaskets.Get 2 they are cheap.
And get rid of the electric fuel pump.
With a good squeezie and rebuilt pump you shouldn't need any extra help.
Plus it's like adding a bomb to your bildge if it's not Coast Guard approved.
If you keep the pump put it under the motor cover somewhere.
 
S

shakazulu

Seaman
Joined
May 16, 2011
Messages
67
Re: Starting hard Force 125

I replaced fuel pump diaphragm and it seems that it solved the problem. When cold I need to start it with choke 1 or 2 times and then without choke and it starts good. When warm it starts from first try .

I wanted to ask is my choke function good, when cold I crank it with choke but it newer starts with choke, it just spits out on exhaust and then I need to crank it again without choke and then it starts good. Sholud the motor start with choke on and work some time with choke on? Or it is not made to work with choke on? What is good procedure to start with choke ?
 
jerryjerry05

jerryjerry05

Supreme Mariner
Joined
May 7, 2008
Messages
18,075
Re: Starting hard Force 125

The motor should start:motor straight up and down,then pump the ball,fast idle,push in on the choke and turn the key.Should start.
Some motors will flood quick,Then it won't need the choke as much.
I had one that wouldn't always start unless the motor was tilted all the way up.I'd turn the key,choke and it would cough,lower the motor and it would start.
They all should start the same way but some are fickle,and need to be messed with.
Experiment on different ways to start.
Find what work for your motor.
 
J

jason32038

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
May 25, 2009
Messages
555
Re: Starting hard Force 125

I wonder what the point of the spring in the fuel pump is?? It looks like it just puts more stress on the diaphram. I would personally remove it...wouldnt it work without it? My 85hp doesnt have it and it works fine. :)
 
J

jason32038

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
May 25, 2009
Messages
555
Re: Starting hard Force 125

ALSO..I noticed when I had my mixture screws set to 1 turn out it would cough and spit and pop loudly when trying to start. I turned them all to 1 1/2 turns out and it starts like a dream. I prime..go about half fast idle..hold choke in and crank for about 4 seconds and she fires right up and doesnt die but i did rebuild the engine and made sure the reeds were good. Have you checked your reeds?
 
T

TwoFish

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Aug 7, 2010
Messages
373
Re: Starting hard Force 125

As far as I understand the spring is used to store the energy from the crankcase pulse. The spring uses this energy to push the diaphragm to pump fuel. Without the spring the pump would not work very well. The energy from the crankcase pulse would need to be stored by stretching the diaphragm, which it is not designed to do.
 
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