u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

[lil buggy]

good eve to all,
love it here,
i need some advice

heres my story

so lets start off with the boat, engine etc..
89 rinker fiesta vee 250
5.7 liter mercruiser 0c612577 89?
alpha one gen 1 outdrive
supposed to be rebuilt moter because it overheated
bought labor day weekend 2011
many problems
outdrive went out (clutchdog)
bought used newer looking alpha one gen 1 no overheat 2 trips
starter went (rebuilt it)
noise at stern at the slip thought it was a gimbal bearing
wouldnt shift forward would stall
reverse would rev
developed overheat within 5 min at idle at dock while addressing other issues
changed thermostat then removed no change

(resolve)towed to launch
took to boat shop
upper outdrive c clip(holding the u joint in) not mounted correctly let water in
removed newer drive (upper junk lower wet )
remarkably old upper good new lower will need flushed but would like to save
compression check port 160-180
starbord #2 50 rest 160-180
pulled heads
bad
starbord #2 valve tuliped
port #3 wet with oil
#5 cyl had etching from water not bad but fingernail catches
also both sides of head gasket between 3 and 5 black exhaust?
not to mention the vibration from the u joints flailing around
caused the steering ram to leak

so here i am
bellows,exhaust flappers, shiftcable?marry the two drives together, upgrade steering system, reman longblock, plugs, wires, and cap
$7500 including install! $2g more than the price of the boat!

or i could, do starbord head or both marry the drives hope n pray that the lower engine doesnt go out
and since no vibration no steering leak
not likely

third option
fire sale!
fridge works great, hull good, trailer good, great interior and cabin great
sell as (just add whole driveline)
what can i even get with that!

fourth option
pay for troubleshoot time add another $500 i am sure
get second opinion

anyways, take the seller to court!
i am a man of my word(i guess i expect it to be the norm)
it is a shame i bought from a well known and respected marina owner
that somehow bought it off of one of his tenants (bought a new one)
and got someone to work on (well kinda)

i have had outboard boats all my life
and with all or most boats you gotta expect a little repairs
but i am at my wits end with this

what do you guys think?

 

[etracer68]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

Sounds to me like you got the short end of that deal. Also theres something wrong with your respected marina owner, if he will not do anything for you. The motor may have alot of other issues too, as far as the stern drive, well, find someone that can make a good one from the two. The motor should be pulled and gone through, or new one. Your not in a good place, sorry to hear about, but I never trusted anyone word, unless I knew the person for a long time. Test Ride, or have the boat gone through by a trusted person, is a must!!!!!!!!! I wish you the best.

 

[CRay45DB]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

Have you talked to the Marina owner who you bought this from? Did he the transaction as an individual or on the company letter head. You have to know who to sue. What is the max amount you can sue over in small claims? Costs 15 bucks and you are usually better than an attorney. Having a letter sent from your attorney is money wasted. Everyone sues everyone, he probably would not even read it.

As is is as is. Say that three times fast? I would not do anything till you talk to him. If he has a good reputation, he might help you out, did you steal this or did you pay market price?

Winning in court is 50/50, depends on who the judge is. Talk to him, check limit at your stalls claim and a rationale non-emotional person gets farther than the squeaky wheel.

Good luck.

 

[Fireman431]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

I think SBL is trolling us....

 

[NHGuy]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

I don't think SBL writes as technically as that. He does use that short staccato form though.

 

[wagnerz]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

Its tough to win in court. Your best bet is to try and go back to the person who sold it to you, and try and work something out. Then try and get as much money from the boat as you can.

 

[NHGuy]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

Was your purchase a retail transaction? Contact the seller and explain what has transpired. The seller may be obligated do the entire repair. Or he may want help you out at an agreed cost. Even if the seller is not on the hook he may be willing to work with you to get you back on the water. I'm sure he has technicians if he runs a marina, and it's November, not exactly prime time.
Then if you feel hosed post up your situation in here, we have lots of opinions.

If the boat is really as good as you say I'd get both heads off & checked. Serviced as needed. Make 1 drive out of the good pieces, put it together, make sure the shift is adjusted right, and then you are where you should have been.
Research tuliped valves. They often occur for a reason.

 

[lil buggy]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

thanks for all the support,
who is SBL?
to answer some of your questions,

2 test drives before sale no issues wot for three or four minutes,

i did talk to seller through each issue as it was happening
he gave me alot of,(what could cause that,what do you think etc..) no real offer of any kind
except a truck starter that had the wrong bendix gear that i couldnt use anyway woulda caused more issue
at that point i realized there was no help
seller under his name not companys.

small claims court $100 to file $5000 max amount in pa (so i have been told)
he is starting to get slimy quickly

i was quoted a price of $4050
that would get me
plugs, wires bellows,lower shiftcable,
marry the two drives into 1,
and send out both heads to be machined and updated steering system(from the leak) winterize
and all the labor not including tax

that of course was before the mechanic pulled the port head
and saw water damage etching (fingernail catches)
oil on walls of #3 cyl
and black marks both sides of gasket between cyl 3 and 5
same boat shop serviced the boat last year before seller got a hold of it
noted water in cyl #3 and 5
thats when the estimate went up $3000 for a mercruiser remanned longblock (authorized merc dealer and shop)
being that the engine was overheated and water intrusion mechanic recommended repower
said it would be a shame to put the 4500 into it and get little time before something else in the lower engine went
what do you guys think

 

[lil buggy]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

also, talked with seller tonight
offered 1000 or unknown truck 350 auto block with unknown miles
to stay out of court

i cant figure my new scanner out or i would post printed ad from craigslist
so i will type it

RINKER 1989 25' - $6000
1989 25 FT RINKER WITH TRAILER.BUILT 350 MERCRUISER,REBUILT MOTER, NEW STARTER AND IMPELLER.
OUTDRIVE IN GOOD WORKING CONDITION. CANVAS TOPS WITH WINDOWS,NEW CAPTAINS CHAIR,NEW STEREO SYSTEM.
COMES WITH FENDERS AND EXTRA PROP

was not bought as is
(was told engine goes ill give you one, i got any part you need)
if the starter was a good indication of (parts) not sure of any parts he would give

again thanks for the support and the replies

out of the ad this was true
89 rinker, trailer,outdrive (worked for 3 trips)
canvas top with windows(ruff needs most of the zippers and front eising glass)
1 fender and extra prop (4weeks before i got it)

i guess i am pissed beside being in a spot
can we all say lemon?
where do i go from here? still unsure?

i could probably get away without steering upgrade $805.78
mechanic wanted it(not sure whats going on there or if it can be fixed dripping power steering fluid from ram at transom)

 

[smokeonthewater]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

a set of reman heads from the auto parts store would be a few hundred.... STAINLESS head gaskets from the auto parts store (special order) would be 50 to 100. swap the drive parts around... tell seller 1500 and you have over a grand to pay for labor if you can't do it yourself

as for the steering, find the actual problem.... You should be able to get any needed part for the steering for under $100 and maybe under $10 on ebay

 

[jacoboregon]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

Unfortunately, caveat emptor prevails in most states without a written contract or warranty. I'd try for the $1500, too. If not, I'd accept the $1000. The price of $7500 seems pretty high to me. A 5th option is to cruise craigslist. Unfortunately, I was in a similar situation years ago with a "respectable" marina who would not stand behind their "word" and I ended up with a motor with compression from 50-90 psi. I was told the carb needed some work, but the issue ended up being the compression. Fortunately I found a Kodiak marine 351 a guy had removed for a re-power job and I ended up with it for $900. It was a great engine. I have a friend that likes the phrase "education costs". Sorry to hear about your trouble.

 

[lil buggy]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

thanks guys,
good ideas,
are you guys worried about the etching or the oily cyl?
i guess i am worried about my (luck)

 

[series60]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

The big question is: Can you do the work? Do you have the time to save the money? No - them there aren't any real good options!

$7500 including install! $2g more than the price of the boat!

So $5500 for a 1989 boat - sounds like too much but that's just me.

or i could, do starboard head or both marry the drives hope n pray that the lower engine doesn't go out
and since no vibration no steering leak
not likely

Never liked doing just the heads without doing the rings and bearings. SBC will run for a long time even if everything isn't just perfect but when you up the compression with a valve job you put much more pressure on the old bearings. Again I ask- Can you do the work?

As for the leg, shouldn't be a big issue but I would suggest a pressure test on it first. If you have any mechanical skills you search this forum and read the manual and probably sort out most of the issues. Ask questions here, there are very helpful and knowledgeable folks here willing to help.

what do you guys think?

IMHO that's what I think.

 

[Maclin]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

Doesn't SEI make replacement drives for that same unit? Comes with warranty and everything, seems like a better solution for the long run as far as the ourdrive part of the OP's dilemma.

 

[lil buggy]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

thanks guys,
sei does make a replacement drive,
but i heard when it comes to the warranty, shipping and denials kill the price.
i know a guy with the sei that had issues i think he is on the third replacement.
not sure how many are in service in my area. we always hear the bad stuff
i am not knocking the sei i just dont know.

as far as working on it i can do some of the stuff but as far as the bottom end of the engine goes? it is over my head.
my first choice of shops called me back this am. it has slowed down a little. he does all the machine work in house. that should help on the price
i can certainly get into some of the stuff to help cut the costs

9 to 10k is the normal for a private seller of a decent cruiser around the same vintage around here
with quoted work i blow that outa the water

it seems a little time has calmed me down some

i guess it comes down to
FIRE SALE = not much more money involved but i am sure that $5k lost i am into $7k presently (i will not sneak this off on anyone unknowingly)

keep it! bite the bullet do the repairs and hope that i can start trusting the boat.

agreed series60, slaping heads on and hoping the bottom end holds out isnt the way to go.
doing the same and selling to an unsuspecting soul i just wont do(after all, that is why i am posting this)

we will see what today brings

thanks all for the continued support
and as always thanks for the replies

to be continued...

i am supprised that no one chimed in with (LEMON)

 

[Summer Fun]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

Look here for a 5.7 engine. $1.550 & $150 shipping with no core charge.

http://www.rapidomarine.com/default.aspx?p=/engines/default.aspx

 

[smokeonthewater]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

you don't have to HOPE that the bottom end is ok.... It doesn't take long at all to bolt the heads on and do a compression test.... If you have a good compression test and good oil pressure with a warm engine, odds are real good that the engine is FINE.... lots and lots of money is thrown away rebuilding things that don't need it.

FWIW, my folks chevy pickup stuck a valve due to carbon buildup years ago and the piston hit and bent it... I pulled the heads and took em to the machine shop for one new valve, new guides and and new seals. I sanded the light ding out of the top of the piston. $200 Another $200 in gaskets, seals, timing chain, belts, and a tensioner. That was 5 years and close to 100,000 miles ago (some of it towing a 10,000 lb camper) and the truck still runs perfect, uses no oil and gets good mpg.

You could ALSO scour craigs list for a crappy boat with a good engine.... A decent mechanic can swap out a mercruiser v-8 in an hour or two. I've had one out in under 15 minutes.

 

[25thmustang]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

I read that the boat was sea trialed and appeared to be in working order when purchased? Was it checked by a mechanic, oil checked, drive checked, compression, leak down?

If the seller knew there were issues and sold you junk, then it is shame on him. If the seller sold what he thought was a good working, running boat, that surveyed and checked out ok, then I guess it doesn't really fall on him.

I fell for you, as nothing is worse than huge failure on a new to you boat. Not knowing all the details though, I can't justify jumping in and bad mouthing the previous owner.

 

[lil buggy]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

summerfun,
thanks for the quote.
i found this on us engines inc
http://www.usenginesinc.com/Marine-...-Engine.html?gclid=CL6Fw9--xqsCFUJo5QodaW_h5Q

smokeonthewater,
was thinking of donor boat also
not finding anything outweighing above 300hp

25thmustang,
no it wasn't checked by a mechanic, not surveyed
compression test was done after laundry list was created.
seller did know that there was many issues, overheat damage, engine waterdamage etc...
boat shop serviced previously and noted the water damage, overheat damage etc.. was asked advice
advice was ignored

with each issue seller shed more light on the real truth
slowly i found out that the only thing that was done was that the heads were sent out and were bad
replaced by a different unknown set
and the thermostat gasket was replaced thats it.

as far as bashing the previous owner it goes like this
the previous owner knew there were problems
and didnt let me know
just wrong in my eyes

in fact
he deserves a big round of applause from the (LEMON CLUB)
sorry, thats a touchy subject

i am trying to make lemonade outa this lemon.

to be continued...
we will see what tomorrow brings

thanks for the continued support,
and as always thanks for the replies

 

[25thmustang]

Re: u gotta hear this! help repower or? basket case

Thanks for the clarification on that. It sounds as though he did know there were issues, and that is a true shame. Definately keep us updated on what you plan to do with the situation.