Warning....Test your own gas

[sigma]

Just read another post on another forum. Testing in some states has shown as much as 20% ethanol in fuel marked no ethanol so test your own fuel.

Buy you gas at the same station all the time and test it from time to time by pouring some in a glass jar and let it sit a day or so to see if it does have ethanol. If it does it should seperate as well as the moisture/water in it.

 

[Fl_Richard]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

Really? Ethanol will seperate from gas? Never heard this.

I'd be suing the bejesus out of someone for selling fuel marked "no ethanol" that actually was mixed.

 

[PeterMcG]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

Really? Ethanol will seperate from gas? Never heard this.

If enough water is present, a water/ethanol phase can appear and settle to the bottom.

 

[Rocky_Road]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

A Chevron station here in my city had to pump their underground tanks dry, when a state inspection found that their gas was over the 10% (E-10) limit.

It happens!

P.S. my local BP stations are advertising that their gas is ethanol free...and they are selling a lot of gas to the boaters. I am toying with getting one of those consumer test kits...and see if they are being truthful.

Happy boating!

 

[Fl_Richard]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

I know if there is water present the water will seperate.

I thought the OP was stating you could test fuel containing ethonol for ethanol concentrations in a jar and the ethonol would seperate from the gasoline.

 

[jasper60103]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

and what does ethanol look like?

 

[BeaufortTJustice]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

I know if there is water present the water will seperate.

I thought the OP was stating you could test fuel containing ethonol for ethanol concentrations in a jar and the ethonol would seperate from the gasoline.

Not trying to put words in anyone's mouth, but I think you are misinterpreting PeterMcG's comment...if enough water is present, along with the ethanol (which can absorb moisture from the air), it will visibly separate. That was my interpretation of the comment...I could be wrong.

 

[jetmart]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

Testing fuel for ethanol

The following test can be performed to determine the presence of ethanol in gasoline.

On a test tube or olive bottle, make a permanent line about two inches from the bottom.

Fill with water to this line, then fill the tube to the top with gasoline.

Cover the tube, agitate it then let it stand.

Ethanol mixes with water and the two will separate out together. Therefore, after mixing the water and the gasoline, if the water level appears to have increased, then the fuel contains ethanol

 

[Rocky_Road]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

Not trying to put words in anyone's mouth, but I think you are misinterpreting PeterMcG's comment...if enough water is present, along with the ethanol (which can absorb moisture from the air), it will visibly separate. That was my interpretation of the comment...I could be wrong.

I think that you read it right. In theory you can place some E-10 in an open jar, and the humidity in the air can be picked up by the ethanol, and show up as phase seperation. This is from an article I just read:

"Phase Separation describes what happens to gasoline containing Ethanol when water is present. When gasoline containing even small amounts of Ethanol comes in contact with water, either liquid or in the form of humidity; the Ethanol will pick-up and absorb some or all of that water. When it reaches a saturation point the Ethanol and water will Phase Separate, actually coming out of solution and forming two or three distinct layers in the tank.

Phase Separation is also temperature dependent. For example, E-10 can hold approximately .05% water at 60?F. To better understand the amount of water that we are talking about, picture 1 gallon of E-10 at 60?F. This gallon will hold approximately 3.8 teaspoons of water. However if the temperature drops to 20?F it can only hold about 2.8 teaspoons of water.

Phase Separation can happen in an underground or an aboveground storage tank, a vehicle tank, a boat tank, in any type of equipment tank, and even in the gas can in your garage.

When this happens, you can have serious and even catastrophic engine problems, without warning.

When this Phase Separation occurs you will have an upper layer of gasoline with a milky layer of Ethanol and Water below it, and then in many cases a third layer of just water at the bottom."

http://fuelschool.blogspot.com/2009/02/phase-separation-in-ethanol-blended.html

Happy boating!

 

[sfy]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

never knew these tests were possible, thanks for the info.
if separation has occurred, is it possible to severely agitate the fuel and get the stuff to re-combine, or is it just best to drain it and replace it?

also, will putting stuff like Stabil in the tank help prevent separation if Ethanol is involved?

 

[Rocky_Road]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

never knew these tests were possible, thanks for the info.
if separation has occurred, is it possible to severely agitate the fuel and get the stuff to re-combine, or is it just best to drain it and replace it?

also, will putting stuff like Stabil in the tank help prevent separation if Ethanol is involved?

Take a minute and read the article I linked above...phase seperation is permanent, cannot be reversed.

Marine Stabil (blue) is the answer...but not after the fact!

Happy boating!

 

[Fl_Richard]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

Jetmart - Now thats cool! I'm gonna try it.

Thank you!

 

[dingbat]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

I think that you read it right. In theory you can place some E-10 in an open jar, and the humidity in the air can be picked up by the ethanol, and show up as phase seperation.

I actuality this would never happen. People seem to forget that there is a constant cycle of evaporation and absorption taking place.

The vapor pressure (rate of evaporation) for gasoline is much greater than the rate which ethanol absorbs water. The gasoline is the jar would have simply evaporated long before it had a chance to absorb enough to even saturate the fuel let alone cause phase separation.

Now if you force moisture into the fuel by agitating it and blowing water saturated air into it then yes, it will saturate and possibly separate quite quickly.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

Geez -- More paranoia! I have complained about all the E10 garbage that has passed through this forum time and time again and the same "end of the world as we know it" stories keep turning up. For gosh sakes folks, treat the fuel, use a water separating fuel filter and go boating. We've used ethanol blended fuel here in the upper midwest since 1997 and there simply are no issues if your engine and fuel system was designed with ethanol tolerant components (which most engines since before that time were). Yes - if you have an older rig, carb rebuilds with new components and ethanol tolerant hoses will ensure you don't have an issue. Our boats are layed up from November to April each year, the vast majority of them with "treated" E10 in the tank and they continue on just fine in the spring. Even my yard equipment uses the stuff and some of that yard equipment is many decades old and has not suffered any E10 consequences. Water can be an issue if you happen to have a very large fuel tank, use the boat very little, or if you live on either coast where high air moisture exists on a regular basis. Again, fuel treatment and a proper filter is all you need.

 

[Rocky_Road]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

I actuality this would never happen. People seem to forget that there is a constant cycle of evaporation and absorption taking place.

The vapor pressure (rate of evaporation) for gasoline is much greater than the rate which ethanol absorbs water. The gasoline is the jar would have simply evaporated long before it had a chance to absorb enough to even saturate the fuel let alone cause phase separation.

Now if you force moisture into the fuel by agitating it and blowing water saturated air into it then yes, it will saturate and possibly separate quite quickly.

A southern Florida boat repair shop did a video all about ethanol laced gas, and they blew air over the top of the container and phase separation became visible long before the gas level seemed to decrease significantly. It was pretty interesting to see! Their reason for making the video was in response to the ever-increasing repairs that they were doing on fuel systems.

I will try to find the link for this, again!

Happy boating!

 

[Yepblaze]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

The sky is falling.

 

[allinmygarage]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

The sky is falling.

Hillarious

I agree with Silvertip. In MN almost all of the gas had ethanol and I have never heard of anyone having a problem. My snowmobiles, boats, cars and yard equipment is all fine. Most of which is older then 1990 and has to be stored for a long time each year. I put staybil in in the fall and a little seafoam in the spring and have never had a problem with anything. And no matter how many horror stories I read I will continue to do it this way.

 

[puddle jumper]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

Interesting read. At work we have lots of water/fuel problems and we live in a very high humidity area. I am starting to wonder if maybe we are getting e10 fuel and not knowing it. Lets put it this way in the gas pickups alone we changed 300+ pumps last year due to water.

Is there also the same problem with diesel?

Note- we have a good filter system on our fuel tanks
- we have 160 pickups in our fleet

 

[Bronc Rider]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

Its pretty humid in my area and we dont have any issues with water over here. At work we have trucks, cranes, forklifts etc. and none of it has water problems. I have a car and a motorcycle that rarely get started. When I want to start them all I have to do is make sure the battery is charged. I start and run them once or twice a year with no problems. I don't use fuel stabilizer either. e10 has been succesfully used in the Houston area for many years.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Warning....Test your own gas

160 pickups in the fleet and you replaced 300 pumps last year???? That on average is nearly two per vehicle. If water is causing the fuel pump failure someone is pouring it into the tank. I just don't believe that claim -- sorry!