what to consider for 'open water' boat

[Dustin07]

I'm trying to find a one-size-fits-all duck hunting boat.

I found a 16ft valco jet sled with 40hp merc that has a pump. price is OK, with trailer $4300 obo.

I"m wanting something that i can use inland, up and down the rivers, work the tidal flats, and still big enough to take out into the bay safely. he says it has a 2ft freeboard.

What are your thoughts? big enough? things I should look for? price seems fair if the motor is in good condition. comes with lower prop unit, duck blind, trailer.

 

[Solittle]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

I'm trying to find a one-size-fits-all duck hunting boat.

I found a 16ft valco jet sled with 40hp merc that has a pump. price is OK, with trailer $4300 obo.

I"m wanting something that i can use inland, up and down the rivers, work the tidal flats, and still big enough to take out into the bay safely. he says it has a 2ft freeboard.

What are your thoughts? big enough? things I should look for? price seems fair if the motor is in good condition. comes with lower prop unit, duck blind, trailer.

That is an inland water rig that should not venture out in any open water unless run close to shore on relatively calm days. It and you have no business in going off shore under any conditions. Yes you may get posts that will disagree and there have been trips made from the Florida coast to the Bahamas but is it safe - - not with me aboard.

 

[bob johnson]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

I'm trying to find a one-size-fits-all duck hunting boat.

I found a 16ft valco jet sled with 40hp merc that has a pump. price is OK, with trailer $4300 obo.

I"m wanting something that i can use inland, up and down the rivers, work the tidal flats, and still big enough to take out into the bay safely. he says it has a 2ft freeboard.

What are your thoughts? big enough? things I should look for? price seems fair if the motor is in good condition. comes with lower prop unit, duck blind, trailer.

a BIG heck no on the open water ESPECIALLY where you are located...

and a 40 hp jet is way to little power, even for a 16 footer..

if you had a 40 HP prop motor and you had a blind or spray shield up...you would still have to watch the weather.

I used to run a 16 footer for duck hunting and I got caught out in a few nor easters off the atlantic...waves went to 8 foot... the closed bow and spray shield i had shed the waves... but barely... the boat took a beating...cracked a bench seat in half...popped a few rivets,
falling through air in between waves.....

the problem is you can drown 100 feet from shore. if the boat turns over!!

so it really isnt a distance thing

it is a water condition thing...

I understand that the seas can get deadly out on the west coast up your way pretty fast... shallows push up tremendous swells and cause havoc..

but all is relative.. 25 ' can be unsafe some days.

use your best judgement...

seamanship and bilge pumps go a long way to makeing a boat think it is bigger than it really is.

good luck

bob

 

[Dustin07]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

yeah my terminology of open water may have been misused. I'm talking Puget Sound, worst wakes/waves I've seen were abut 6'. It is salt but I'm working the inland salt bays. areas like these:

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=nisqu...=&startPage=1&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wl

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=samis...=&startPage=1&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wl

I normally work the area with a 20' lund fisherman series which is fantastic for what we are doing (fishing) but I don't think its appropriate for the tidal flats, and its too nice for duck hunting, so I'm looking for an alternative. I'd like something smaller too if possible.

what are your recommendations? there is a really nice Lund 14ft Alaskan for $15k with trailer and jet (new) but that feels too small. I'd like at least 16-18ft I think.

I know how you guys feel about this valco, but what would you recommend as an alternative.

I would not venture into the water if evil weather was forecasted (although I do know that it's best to be safe as you never know what can surprise you).

I also have no intentions of ever going coastal, just inland salt bays.

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

Carolina Skiff
Chincoteague Scow (design, not brand)
convert a Parker
Lowe Roughneck

I can't speak to jet drives, though.

For cold weatehr, focus on design that sheds water and bows that have a fast recovery. Spoon bows do this, as do well-placed chines along the sides of the boat. The Carolina Skiff has a rolled over gunwale that keeps it dry, plus very high flotation

 

[bob johnson]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

the first map looked like it was Turks and Caicos, really nice place but few ducks i wager.. ha ha

that is some tidal flat...there in the other map!.

I got a boat that I felt was the best mix for both worlds... rough water and shallow tidal flats where the water goes away fast and you have to have a boat that floats shallow or you have less of a window to get your boat out before you go dry!!

it was a 12 degree dead rise MOD V.. 2070... added flotation pods to the back to help lift the transom with the big motor....a jack plate let me lift the motor and run in the shallow flats with out trying to drive the transom back down into the sand...

it will float in 7" of water and i can start out motoring in as little as 13-15" of water....and stay level...maybe going 5-8 mph.

it gets on plane in a heartbeat and can run in maybe 10" of water as slow as maybe 18 mph..

I built a closed bow spary shield on my rig to keep a lot of water out in rough seas and I have 2 1000 gph bilge pumps...


I think the LUND drafts too deep for your needs

you have some compromizes to make on your boat choice...

shallow draft USUALLY means rougher ride in a chop...but with those HUGE tidal flats....you really need shallow draft boat....

what kind of tide rise and falls do they see there?

bob

 

[Dustin07]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

thanks for the feedback, I actually was looking at a roughneck before so maybe I'll keep looking at that. The Skiffs are new to me, I hadn't even thought about that before.

 

[bob johnson]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

thanks for the feedback, I actually was looking at a roughneck before so maybe I'll keep looking at that. The Skiffs are new to me, I hadn't even thought about that before.

my boat is a LOWE ULTRA ROUGHNECK

the ultra means they are wider than standard...

I wouldnt go with less dead rise than 10 degrees and 12 is better, as long as the bottom is wide.....it will work for you in that shallow bay

bob

 

[Dustin07]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

sorry Bob, i completly missed your first post.

tides fluctuate a lot. Especially this year there have been some really high tides combined with average or low low tides. to give you an example, one high tide went from +10 to -2. The morning tide I hunted went from +11 to +5. We find that while hunting layout boats following the tide out, we can have a few hundred yards or more of dry ground where we used to have our decoys floating... so i have to be prepared to move quick or drag the boat to the water...

 

[rwhodel]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

Dustin, I live just north of you in Everett. I see sleds out in the sound all the time. Just keep an eye on the weather, you would be fine. The sled would work fine in Nisqually Flats and Samish Bay, just watch the tides so you do not end up high and dry when the tide goes out.

 

[Dustin07]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

Thanks RW- I'm looking at those roughnecks more and more. I love to lake fish (bass) and I know I'd get year round use out of it. Last week I was up at pencove bay in the whidbey area and the water was so calm I think the sled would be fine.

http://www.loweboats.com/showroom/welded-jon/roughneck-jon/r2065cc.php

I am thinking about it more and more and I would spend more time in the tidal flats and lakes, so If I'm going to invest, I think the flat bottom is the way to go for me.

 

[bob johnson]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

Thanks RW- I'm looking at those roughnecks more and more. I love to lake fish (bass) and I know I'd get year round use out of it. Last week I was up at pencove bay in the whidbey area and the water was so calm I think the sled would be fine.

http://www.loweboats.com/showroom/welded-jon/roughneck-jon/r2065cc.php

I am thinking about it more and more and I would spend more time in the tidal flats and lakes, so If I'm going to invest, I think the flat bottom is the way to go for me.

that 3.5 degree deadrise will pound the snot out of you when the blow kicks up....

you will start to lose fillings from your teeth.

crestliner changed their boat( used to be the exact same boat as the one I have) now though they offer a 10 degree hull even though it doesnt have the beam(98") the ultra has, it still has a decent( 90") and it also still has the bottom width( 70")...

I am thinking you will not have that flat bottom long...

good luck anyway

bob

 

[Dustin07]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

the most i can find is an 8 degree with lowes roughneck series:

http://www.loweboats.com/showroom/welded-jon/roughneck-jon/rv170cc.php

 

[bob johnson]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

the most i can find is an 8 degree with lowes roughneck series:

http://www.loweboats.com/showroom/welded-jon/roughneck-jon/rv170cc.php

yeah they stopped making the YLTRA series a few years ago, last year I bought mine as a left over.

up until a few years ago both crestliner and lowe were owned by the same company and thus the crestliner and the ultra rough neck were the exact same hull, just rigged and labeled different.

now crestliner still makes a 2070...but the beam is a little marrower... and the hull is 10 degrees...still a better choice...cant speak for how they are made now.

they offer an ALASKAN package that offers the center or side console with minimum decking...so you get down INSIDE the boat, instead of always walking at gunnel height!!( not a good duck boat design).

sea ark offers 15 degree hull..... and excell offers a variable deadrise hull...

but i think they have too much decking.. they all want to make the boat attractive to bass fishermen as well....which i think hurts for the duck hunter..

good luck


bob

 

[erikpn]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

Dustin, I live just north of you in Everett. I see sleds out in the sound all the time. Just keep an eye on the weather, you would be fine. The sled would work fine in Nisqually Flats and Samish Bay, just watch the tides so you do not end up high and dry when the tide goes out.

I am also north of you and live on the sound. People regularly take $20 rubber inflatable boats and canoes out here in the summer. The typical puget sound chop is 1' or less. Pick your days and you can head out in anything. The non locals don't really see the conditions here and it isn't like the coast.

 

[bob johnson]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

I am also north of you and live on the sound. People regularly take $20 rubber inflatable boats and canoes out here in the summer. The typical puget sound chop is 1' or less. Pick your days and you can head out in anything. The non locals don't really see the conditions here and it isn't like the coast.

its good to get another local tip....BUT...

BUT, please dont think about what summer boaters do and compare that to winter time boating.

what is a mere inconvience in the summer is death in the winter!!!

that must be a nice bay if the chop is sledom over a foot..

you can still float shallow with a decent amount of dead rise if you got a wide foot print on the water.

good luck, let us know what you pick out!!

bob

 

[Dustin07]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

Thanks Bob, and you are right. I have been out in days where it was very little wake, but I've been on days where it feels flat, and then a ferry goes by a 1/2 mile away, sending me 4-6FT waves. thats just unavoidable. I got so sick of them I started anticipating them from a good mile away and going WAY around them. (this was in the bigger boat, 20FT lund fisherman series.)

 

[dave11]

Re: what to consider for 'open water' boat

There are two 16 ft boats that you might look at. I have an Alumaweld with a 60 HP Yaamha. I have been caught out in the Gulf in 5 ft seas with wind and short interval wave spacing. Not fun but safe. I can get down to approx 10 inches of water. The other is a Hewes Craft. Similar boat but a little wider beam, which would help in the shallows.