1974 Johnson 50hp Stuck.

[Keyboardman]

http://www.marineengine.com/newparts/part_details.php?pnum=OMC0385798

 

[Chrisravosa36]

Ok, Im going to war with these f****** bolts!!! m getting the second piston out this weekend!!!!

 

[Chrisravosa36]

????--Vicegrip will not work on those rod bolts.-----Need to get the PROPER 12 point THINWALL socket .---Then the job will be easy !

I got a new socket again today, it was indeed a 5/16 12 point thin wall, fit like a glove, then it stripped the bolts, the previous mechinic/owner must have tightened them WAYYY to tight! Im not sure what to do...Should I drill and tap them out??

 

[racerone]

Drill the head off.---Remove the rod cap.----The remaining piece of the rod bolts should then come out with your fingers.

 

[AlTn]

time to talk about what you think you're gonna find when that rod and piston are out...unusuable crank?..probably...rod bearings pitted and unusable?...probably....sooo...looked for a good powerhead?...you may be time, money and effort ahead going that route

 

[gm280]

WOW Chris. I think somebody really torqued them beyond the proper toque range. While they are supposed to be torqued, they are not that tough to remove...usually. At this stage of the issue, you have to remove them and inspect the bearings and crank and purchase new rod bolts and rebuild. Have you been able to loosen the main caps yet? If you can't get them out, maybe take it to a machine shop and have them remove the rest. Just a thought. If I were there, I am certain I could remove them even if I had to weld a part on the top of them to help. But I am not there and so your options are a little more limited. Have you used any heat at the joint when trying to remove them? :noidea:

 

[Chrisravosa36]

Drill the head off.---Remove the rod cap.----The remaining piece of the rod bolts should then come out with your fingers.

So your suggesting that I drill the head of the bolt off untill the rode cap, and how do you know the rest of the bolt will come out easier??

*EDIT* I understand now looking at the previous bolts I took out, It has no grip on the top part, so it should allow me to take the piston out.

 

[Chrisravosa36]

time to talk about what you think you're gonna find when that rod and piston are out...unusuable crank?..probably...rod bearings pitted and unusable?...probably....sooo...looked for a good powerhead?...you may be time, money and effort ahead going that route

Ive inspected all the bearings on the crank, exsept these last needle bearings, everything checked out and is spinning free. The first piston I took out was in great condition, so Im hoping this one will be the same. Lets be optimistic here! + there are many used cranks on ebay and other websites for this year of a motor.

 

[Chrisravosa36]

WOW Chris. I think somebody really torqued them beyond the proper toque range. While they are supposed to be torqued, they are not that tough to remove...usually. At this stage of the issue, you have to remove them and inspect the bearings and crank and purchase new rod bolts and rebuild. Have you been able to loosen the main caps yet? If you can't get them out, maybe take it to a machine shop and have them remove the rest. Just a thought. If I were there, I am certain I could remove them even if I had to weld a part on the top of them to help. But I am not there and so your options are a little more limited. Have you used any heat at the joint when trying to remove them? :noidea:

Ive tried basically everything exsept welding. My brother has a welder and has been using it for about 6 months now, he helped me weld the socket onto the adapter when the adapter snapped, id say he is somewhat experised, so I might try welding a screw driver or something sideways to it.... Im going to leave this option up for disscussion, because I dont know much about the bolt and if this could damage anything. Great idea though!!!

 

[racerone]

Drill the heads off !---Then no load on the rest of the bolt.--Should spin out with your fingers.---Yes it does take time to learn this simple stuff.

 

[gm280]

Ive tried basically everything exsept welding. My brother has a welder and has been using it for about 6 months now, he helped me weld the socket onto the adapter when the adapter snapped, id say he is somewhat experised, so I might try welding a screw driver or something sideways to it.... Im going to leave this option up for disscussion, because I dont know much about the bolt and if this could damage anything. Great idea though!!!

Chirs, you could drill them out like racerone suggested, and go that route. If you try to weld anything on the head of the bolts, may it some type of nut or something you can use a regular tool on. Other wise you will end up with something on there that won't allow a lot of force to be used. But if a drill will cut into them fairly easy, try that and see. Either way, you have to now remove them. JMHO!

 

[Chrisravosa36]

I just started to try to drill them out, it's gunna be a while. Can anybody link me to a good metal drill bit? Amazon or something because I just have crap wood ones

 

[gm280]

Most any home improvement place should have drill bits capable of drilling them out. Cobalt, TIN, Carbide, HSS type bits would work.

 

[Chrisravosa36]

Most any home improvement place should have drill bits capable of drilling them out. Cobalt, TIN, Carbide, HSS type bits would work.

Found an old bit, not to sharp but it does the trick, takes about 20mins to get the bolt out, havent done the second one yet because the bit is just to dull now. When (if) everthing checks out, I get new rings and all new seals ect. can I just throw the starter on the head to check compression? because id hate to have done all of this and have **** compression (which I doubt would happen with new rings and gaskets)

 

[gm280]

Chris, if you have a grinder and a steady hand, you can easily sharpen the bit if you don't want to wait to buy a new one. I have done it many times. But I also have a Bit Doctor as well. But then I have multiple bits for every size I could ever need. And the sad fact is, I don't know where they all came from as well over the years. :noidea:

 

[Chrisravosa36]

Chris, if you have a grinder and a steady hand, you can easily sharpen the bit if you don't want to wait to buy a new one. I have done it many times. But I also have a Bit Doctor as well. But then I have multiple bits for every size I could ever need. And the sad fact is, I don't know where they all came from as well over the years. :noidea:

These bits were no made for metals, Im going to buy a new kit from HD or Sears.

 

[Chrisravosa36]

Sorry about the lack of an update, I had a recent family emergency and am going away for a few days, I have got close in one hole, and about halfway in the other. I will highly be able to order the rings and gaskets this weekend and put it all back together the week following.

 

[Chrisravosa36]

http://www.*****************/newparts/part_details.php?pnum=OMC0385798

Hi everybody, Im back. I have a few questions to ask. First off I order the powerhead gasket kit, all the seals ect. I ordered a new thermostat and a seal and 2 carb kits, Im going to get the water impeller sometime this month. Also I am very close to getting the second piston out. I am now looking at a pair of controls, Mine has a big red control harness in the motor, I know this connects to the one that comes with the control box. Are most of these universial controls with johnson? Do I need a powershift 2 box? do I need certain cabels? What did you do keyboard man? Also after I get the rings, and powerhead gaskets set, is there anyway I can just put on the starter and check compression?

 

[racerone]

I will try to make it simple to understand.----You need a control box with the big red plug.------Does not matter what it says on the box.--------The big red plug is what you need !

 

[Chrisravosa36]

I will try to make it simple to understand.----You need a control box with the big red plug.------Does not matter what it says on the box.--------The big red plug is what you need !

Gottcha! Ive just heard people saying that some are not compatible, but now that I know they are I have a buddy who might sell his. What about the control cabels? Do I need a certain type?