93 Crownline 196 deck and more

[atjohnson]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

Here is how my current order from US Composites is looking. Please let me know if any of the quantities look to be high or low.

30yd - 50" roll 1708
50yd - 50" roll 1.5oz CSM
4gal - Cabosil
10lb - 1/4" chopped strand
15gal - poly resin
80lb kit (9gal) 2lb density foam (I think this is high, any suggestions)

I am also considering 2 gal of natural gel coat and tint to do bilge, ski locker, rear storage and several small chips pictured above. Or i will go with some of the other paints mentioned here for the large areas and only get a small amount of gel coat for repairs. Do I need wax additive? That has been a toss up for me.

 

[bvetter]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

Here is how my current order from US Composites is looking. Please let me know if any of the quantities look to be high or low.

30yd - 50" roll 1708
50yd - 50" roll 1.5oz CSM
4gal - Cabosil
10lb - 1/4" chopped strand
15gal - poly resin
80lb kit (9gal) 2lb density foam (I think this is high, any suggestions)

I am also considering 2 gal of natural gel coat and tint to do bilge, ski locker, rear storage and several small chips pictured above. Or i will go with some of the other paints mentioned here for the large areas and only get a small amount of gel coat for repairs. Do I need wax additive? That has been a toss up for me.

Looks pretty good. Might be a little heavy on the qty of CSM, but I'm completely new at this so I'm speaking from zero experience. All I know is that I have been using more 1708 and less CSM up to this point because it's way easier to work with around edges.

You will likely need more resin, but 15gal is pretty safe to start. There are some look up tables online that kind of give you an idea of resin needed to wet out 1708 and CSM. I'm sure the experienced guys on the forum can give you a rough idea as well. Don't forget, you will be using it for treating the ply before applying any cloth, and PB chews up alot of resin.

Don't forget MEKP, graduated mixing cups (qt, 2.5qt, gallon), chip brushes, EZ catalyst dispenser (I cannot tell you how freakin' handy this thing is), acetone. Lot's of this stuff you can likely get locally, but it is probably cheaper from USC.

For wax additive, I also bought some for use on the final layups in areas where I will be doing gelcoat. Apparently it will make sanding/grinding just before doing gelcoat way easier (unwaxed resin will plug up discs quickly if it has not cured for weeks).

Buy lots of latex gloves. I found that putting two or three layers on each hand before starting works best, that way I can peel a layer off when they get too sticky and keep going without stopping to put new ones on. I'm almost through my first box of 100 and barely into this project.

Hope this helps. Good luck!

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

10 lbs of Chopped strand is WAY to much. 1 lb is plenty. You only need 1/4 cup per Quart of PB. You'll Use 20 qts..Maybe?? You're gunna need another 5gals of resin I'm pretty sure. A gallon of Gelcoat will do all the areas you've described.

 

[atjohnson]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

Ok, I have finalized my order. I added the extra 5 gal of resin, backed down my chopped strand amount, added a small amount of neutral gel coat for repairs with pigment, added a gallon of white gel coat, and finally some surfacing wax. A big thanks for all of the recommendations. I have been picking up chip brushes, buckets, gloves, and other small stuff a little at a time over the past few weeks. Even taking it a little at a time burns $100 a pop at Lowes. I am going to make a trip to harbor freight before saturday and see what i can get there for cheap as well. The plan for the weekend is to get the transom out, remove the engine mounts and get a good portion of the grinding done if I have enough hours in the day. The reason for the rush is my plywood will be here next wednesday and if I place my glass order monday or tuesday, I can have it in two days so I could start the transom rebuild by next weekend. I know thats really looking a long way into the future for a project like this, but I'm trying to look on the bright side.

 

[bvetter]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

I'm excited to hear how your transom removal goes. I'm not at that stage yet so looking forward to hearing your tips!

 

[atjohnson]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

I did not intend on working any today, but I had a few hours to burn so I went on over. I started on the engine mounts since they were number one on the priority list. I was able to make several cuts with my grinder and cut off wheel and then peel the glass off of the wood/mush. It is scary to think that my engine was riding on these. The glass must have been carrying the weight. Oh.....there was no PL or PB under these, just resting on the hull.


That actually went pretty smooth so I moved on to the transom to see how it was going to go. I started on the "wings" because I knew they had some serious rot. To sum it all up, the transom was poorly installed. The upper portion of the wings were not even tabbed into the hull. I was able to drop my pry bar in and it popped loose. I cut the lower tabbing (against the bottom of the hull) and both wings came off and practically disintegrated when I got it out. The outer layer of glass had also delaminated from the majority of the surface. I don't blame some of this on age but primarily moisture. This is not the best picture but it shows how easy I was able to seperate the glass from the wood and yes the wood was more rotten that I thought.

Ok, this is probably the little bit of OCD left in me from engineering school, but I have made notes and sketches of every little thing that I thought could be specific to my boat. I also have a few Solidworks drawings of the stringer layout as well. I probably went a little overkill, but i would highly suggest sketches of the important stuff.

 

[atjohnson]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

Quick update. I got the transom out. I was built differently from the factory than I thought. The main layer was wrapped in glass and then the center support was tabbed on top of that. Took me a minute to figure out why things weren't breaking loose like I thought they should. I still need to remove some of the outer layers that were actually stuck really good. A chisel works, but is really slow so I will probably use one of the sanding discs to get it off.

I also started grinding today as well. Before I put the flap disc on, I used my cut off wheel to remove as much of the fillets as possible. Depending on the contour of some hulls, this might not be as useful, but it saved me a good bit of sanding time. You do have to pay close attention to the depth you are running or could be filling holes. I will not get to work tomorrow like I had planned due to a last minute business trip, so hopefully I can get back on the grinding this week and get it knocked out ASAP. I will update when I get a chance.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

I did not intend on working any today, but I had a few hours to burn so I went on over. I started on the engine mounts since they were number one on the priority list. I was able to make several cuts with my grinder and cut off wheel and then peel the glass off of the wood/mush. It is scary to think that my engine was riding on these. The glass must have been carrying the weight. Oh.....there was no PL or PB under these, just resting on the hull.


That actually went pretty smooth so I moved on to the transom to see how it was going to go. I started on the "wings" because I knew they had some serious rot. To sum it all up, the transom was poorly installed. The upper portion of the wings were not even tabbed into the hull. I was able to drop my pry bar in and it popped loose. I cut the lower tabbing (against the bottom of the hull) and both wings came off and practically disintegrated when I got it out. The outer layer of glass had also delaminated from the majority of the surface. I don't blame some of this on age but primarily moisture. This is not the best picture but it shows how easy I was able to seperate the glass from the wood and yes the wood was more rotten that I thought.

Yep, always is a surprise when you first start opening up stuff that you 'Thought' or 'I thump tested it (hammer,knock, etc) & it sounded solid.'

Nice job so far on demo. Work safe & be sure to wear all the proper PPE while doing demo, grinding or not.

I suspect the factory used 'standard' 1.5" or 1.25" inch plywood to make the transom, and after installing it in the boat, checked for thickness around the keyhole. Depending on how thick the fiberglass is, whether or not the inner & outer skins are parallel and how tightly the plywood transom mated w/ the fiberglass, they used the necessary thickness of additional ply to make the 'horse collar' (the center support you mentioned above) to reach the ideal 2-2.25" keyhole thru hull dimension.

 

[atjohnson]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

Thanks jbcurt00. I have all the gear. I refer to the tyvek as my steamer bag because the temps got up a little Saturday and I felt like a piece of broccoli. Original key hole thickness was right at the 2 inch mark. When I figured hull thickness, plywood, fiberglass, and glue layer between the two I should be just a hair over the 2" mark. I have not decided on how I will approach the engine mounts yet. I don't like the concept of lag bolts into stacked plywood like the originals were so I'm leaning towards making somewhat of a laminated beam trimmed to the correct dimensions so I can tap into solid wood. Any suggestions?

 

[atjohnson]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

Quick question. How far do I actually need to grind? So far I'm going down to good glass for tabbing but wasn't sure if I needed to make sure I get down to the original hull everywhere. So far I'm about 6 or 7 hours in. I had time to work a few hours Wednesday and about 3.5 or 4 hours today. I will probably only get about half a day in tomorrow due to a birthday party but I'll work with what I can. My plywood is in and I will be picking it up in the morning and glassing supplies will be delivered on Monday. It's all coming together but I sure will be glad to be done grinding.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

its all the original hull, just grind to good glass.

 

[bgc]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

I'm itching just looking at this........:joyous:

 

[atjohnson]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

Ok guys my back is not happy with me but I'm about 75% complete on grinding the stringer beds. Should be able to finish the last of it tomorrow afternoon. I still lack cleaning up the transom really good and the lip from the original deck. So.....if all goes well and I get an afternoon or two this week, then I should be ready to start building the transom next week. I must say, grinding fiberglass has definitely tested my patience with this project. I'm just ready to start putting something back in.

 

[bgc]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

I can empathize with you..... The back pain gets worse when you're laying the new glass. You'll forget all about it when you're out of the water.

 

[christoner2002]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

Looks like a very nice boat, and it seems you have a great handle on making it even better. I am doing a minor rebuild on my boat now. I need to do some gelcoat repairs n mine as well, so I am interested in what you go with on that. Are you going to carpet the floor? Or texture and coat the floor?

 

[atjohnson]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

@christoner2002 I plan on going back with carpet. I did debate on this prior to purchasing my materials but decided I like the feel of carpet on bare feet. For gel coat repairs I have ordered a quart of neutral get coat and pigments to tint both colors from US composites. It should be more than enough to fix 20+ years of pecks and pings.

@bgc my back is hanging in there. Should have a few days to recoupe before I test it again.

Good news.......I have finished grinding all of the stringer beds and even had time to wash out and degrease the hull.

Since the hull was wet I couldn't do a whole lot so I chiseled the remaining chunks of wood from the transom area so all it needs is a little clean up and I'll be ready to start cutting the new one. I also made me a rack for my rolls of fiberglass mat. All in all, things are coming along nicely in my opinion. I think I will definitely start feeling better when I put something back in.

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

It appears you've done an excellent job grinding your hull. If you're installation of Stringers and Transom are equally as good, your boat will be a superior restoration!!!! Nice Work!!!!

 

[christoner2002]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

I agree with the carpet atjohnson. I love the look of textured, gelcoated floors, but I also want the carpet there. So I am going with carpet back in mine as well. I am looking forward to seeing this progress. It looks like you are doing it right.

 

[JTice78]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

Nice job so far on the rebuild. I am looking forward to following you build. I acquired a 93 182BR a little over a year ago. It is in pretty sad shape just the same. I havent had much time or space to work on it since getting it due to moving twice, but now have my own house again with a garage to work on it. I have most of the floor pulled up and foam removed. Along with engine and drive out. I am looking to have to pull the cap in order to get under the bow floor section that is built in to the cap. Did you cut the floor section out in the bow and plan to reglass it back in when the hull is done? Looks like mine will be the exact same build as yours. Biggest thing about mine that makes me shake my head is how the previous owners scabbed it all together to play on the water, but never finished it or even attempted to fix it correctly. I am guessing that since my boat is practically the same as yours just over a foot shorter that materials for mine should be about the same?!

 

[atjohnson]

Re: 93 Crownline 196 deck and more

I appreciate the words of encouragement. I plan to work tomorrow and get the grinding on the transom done so I can start some of the rebuild this weekend. The temperatures are crazy here, mid 60's Saturday and Sunday and 23 this morning, so I hope we can level off and get closer to the 70's so I can do some glassing. I also got my glassing supplies home from work today, so all of the big purchases are home and I should be ready.

@JTice78 I originally cut the cap out because it had been cut in a previous repair that sounds like some of the things you are dealing with in terms of quality. There a couple of pictures of the attempt. After looking now, it would have had to been cut either way. Just like your previous owners, mine had great intentions but went about it in a half cocked manor. Unfortunately, as you and I have both learned, you can only put bandaids on so many problems before you have to go under the knife. Yes, from the other projects that I have seen, you should have the exact same floor plan that I have. Don't quote me, but I believe you can look at other boats up to the later 90's as well. The biggest difference is interior layout. Badfish95 has a very similar restoration that i would encourage you to look at. I would also encourage you to start a thread on your project as well. I did not intend on starting my own, but it has helped me to see my progress in pictures and have plenty of others members help you on some of the detailed questions about the project that you are not sure about. I will be more than happy to answer any questions that I am capable of answering since we have similar projects, but my knowledge is limited at this point because this is my first attempt as well.