ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

[E_Man]

Hey,

Thanks for reading. So I was in Lake Ontario on my 15FT 40hp runabout and the lake was pretty choppy. The boat has a very slight V (practically flat) and it hits the water VERY VERY hard as it bounces on the waves to the point that your *** simply hurts the next day - this and the fact that you can feel water at your feet in the back is when I realized my boat was pretty waterlogged. We were cruising and all was well until my friend in the back squealed that his foot was full of mud. I looked back and my heart dropped; I had a 10+ inch crack in the floor and the mud from between the layers was coming up as it hit the water. I did the only thing I could do and limped it back to shore and quickly launched.

Ladies and gentlemen, judging by the pictures, I have a few questions:
* Since I have successfully done two fiberglass repairs in the past from the outside, what is the least amount of work I can do to drain the water between the layers of the hull and patch this up such that it wouldn't happen anymore?

* How and why did this happen? Even if my boat was not waterlogged, wouldn't there be pressure from the bottom by the impact of hitting the water such that either the top or bottom would layer would break?

* If the only solution here (and I really hope its not) is to tear up the back floor, remove foam, put new positive-buoyancy type of material and reseal, then what else can I use besides foam? I ask this since I have seen countless of people on here complaining that because of a tiny hole in the hull, the entire floor needed to be removed and re-foamed. Basically, I'd rather use 2L (sarcastic) pop bottles filled with air than having to do that every time.

* What steps are required?

Thanks very much for reading.

 

[RWilson2526]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

not sure what you got going on here....are the pictures of your floor (sole of the boat) or is that the bottom of the hull...(the only thing between you and the lake) Either way sounds like you got some major issues with the hull especially combined with the fact it is a flat bottom and you ride it hard.

If your motor runs well, unless you have some sentimental attachment to the boat, find a used hull and throw your motor on that one and retire yours for good.

 

[SS MAYFLOAT]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

If the space between the hull and the floor was full of water, hitting the waves hard will cause that water to hammer against the floor. Something had to give since you cannot compress a liquid. With foam or even an air space, things would give and prevent what has happened. I think the law of hydraulics is what caused your crack.

Like mentioned, there is plenty of boats that have good hulls, but need motors. I think that would be my choice. Glad it didn't get as bad as it did, as it could have been worse...........SS

 

[a70eliminator]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

And you already have patches on the outer hull too? I'm with mayfloat time to start looking for a replacement hull.
I think I have you beat in the hairy arm department lol

 

[SeanT]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

Good lord its coming right for me!

 

[E_Man]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

First and foremost - LOL! Thanks for all responses so far (even this one)

I think I have you beat in the hairy arm department lol

I enclosed a picture of the patch I made to the keel of the outer hull - its the second one I did and it holds like a rock (no pun intended). What you see is only the first of three layers I applied.

I guess I should look for another hull but I don't want to see this one go to waste - it was given new paint a few years back and was newly upholstered so as a project at the very least I'd like to fix it up!

And you already have patches on the outer hull too? I'm with mayfloat time to start looking for a replacement hull.

Thanks for the explanation. So if I remove part of the floor and vacuum out all water, what is the best material (besides foam which eventually absorbs water) that I can stuff so that no pressure builds and it doesn't happen again? I have heard of people using crazy ideas like 2L plastic bottles, pool kickboards, HDPE, etc. Would these actually work to keep the boat afloat temporarily? Please don't think I'm crazy I'm just brainstorming.

I think the law of hydraulics is what caused your crack.

 

[Mark SF]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

Here's my 10c worth.

Normally the void between the hull and the floor is filled with foam. This would help stiffen the hull, and provide some shock absorbance. The floor, foam, and hull together make a strong, stiff, but shock absorbing structure. That foam isn't just for bouyancy, it's for strength.

When that foam gets waterlogged and rots out (which it looks like it has done, from your pics) the hull is no longer strengthened by the floor, and is on it's own as far as strength goes. That's why the hull cracked.

So what you need to do really is remove all that rotted foam, and replace it. Obviously this is not a trivial job and might involve cutting some or most of the floor out. If you don't do this though, I think you'll continue to have problems with cracking of the hull in the future. There are probably other weak points in the hull developing. Next time you might actually sink.

That leads me to say it might be worth looking for a new hull as the easiest option, unless you are willing to invest a lot of time in repairing it.

 

[a70eliminator]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

In the photo of the exterior patch I almost looks like there is a broken stringer behind the patch, I can see it through the resin, that boat took a serious hit which may have compromised the integrity of the hull.

 

[Gary H NC]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

Just my thoughts but i would say that boat is junk. The stringers are most likely rotted out and caused the hull to flex and crack.

Find a good hull and strip that boat out.....

 

[NYBo]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

...the mud from between the layers...

Is this some new construction method of which we're not aware??

It sounds like your boat has been beaten to death over the years (a 15', largely flat-bottomed boat run hard on Lake Ontario???), and it's ready for the grinder. I agree with the others: salvage what's useful and move on. Maybe you can find something more appropriate for the lake.

 

[jonesg]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

Just my thoughts but i would say that boat is junk. The stringers are most likely rotted out and caused the hull to flex and crack.

Find a good hull and strip that boat out.....

Well put, complete structural failure.
Trash it , and its a great excuse to seek out another boat.

 

[Topol_86]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

I'd pull your seats, any cleats, bow/stern eyes etc (essentially gut the thing!) pull your motor off and scrap the hull. Plenty of 14-16' runabouts out there that need motor, seats etc....take all that from your existing hull and transfer over. My $0.02. Once you dig into the hull I'm sure you'll find ALOT more needs replacing than a simple quick fix can safely manage.
If your steering assembly is in good condition, TAKE IT TOO!!! quite costly (I paid $475 for the cable, helm and adapter)

 

[hubbard53]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

trash it

 

[marcortez]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

No matter what you decide to do....repair or replace....I hope you have learned a valuable lesson.

When the boat starts to slam and pound in waves/chop, it's time to S L O W down.....until the slamming stops or is reduced to just a mild "bump"

 

[Chris1956]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

It that a cored hull? Some boats have an exterior FG skin, and an interior FG skin over a core of balsa wood, fir or some other wood. If the wood gets wet, over the years it rots turning to mush (or mud).

There are not usually any foam in the floor, or traditional stingers and frames in these kinds of boats. Repair can be done, but it kind of depends what is rotted and what is not.

 

[metriccrescentwrench]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

....I hope you have learned a valuable lesson.

When the boat starts to slam and pound in waves/chop, it's time to S L O W down.....

Am I married to you? From the instant we leave the no wake zone my wife is on auto-nag - "why do you have to drive so fast?".

Actually, IMHO, the problem wasn't started by bouncing and pounding, fiberglass boats (properly constructed ones anyway) can take a heck of a lot more pounding than the people riding in them. The boat structure was compromised by water intrusion which caused wood and foam to rot. That had to have happened over the course of several years, the foam didn't get that bad overnight. Once the foam and stringers are mush it was just a matter of time before cracks appeard in the fiberglass because it was no longer suppoerted as intended.

 

[E_Man]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

Chris,

Excellent question! I do believe it is. Again, this is a VERY old Crestliner and I believe there is no foam in between the layers, just rotted wood at this point. I will to use needle-nose players to pull some material out from between the crack tonight. I also think that there is only about an inch or two space between the layers. To date, I have not seen a spec of foam come out of this hull.

It that a cored hull? Some boats have an exterior FG skin, and an interior FG skin over a core of balsa wood, fir or some other wood. If the wood gets wet, over the years it rots turning to mush (or mud).

There are not usually any foam in the floor, or traditional stingers and frames in these kinds of boats. Repair can be done, but it kind of depends what is rotted and what is not.

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

if it's truly mud in there, the boat spent some time on the bottom.

some boats are just not seaworthy. You got lucky. If you go out in that boat again, no matter how much work you do on it, and it sinks, you are responsible for the people you take down with you.

 

[Chris1956]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

Eyal, I think you are on to something. I had a '62 14' Crestliner, with a cored hull. The wood in the transom was balsa or some other light strong wood. It turned to mush, from getting wet. I repaired my boat, but It resulted in poor performance, and I cannot recommend it to you.

I cut the interior skin away, scooped out the rotten wood with my hands, until I got to wood that was reasonably strong. I then cut a 3/4" piece of plywood to fit the missing core. I cut a trapazoid shape to avoid the weak spot a rectangle would give. I supported the keel of the boat, and the bow, installed the plywood, and weighted it down with cement block to true the hull and stretch the exterior skin, and poured catalysed poly resin to fill all voids. New skin on the interior and on the bottom completed the repair.

After the repair the rear of the boat was strong and planed well on the aft (repaired) section. The unrepaired section was softer and tended to flop around, when you hit a wave.

 

[E_Man]

Re: ALMOST SWAMPED! Large floor crack after bouncing on waves. PICTURES INSIDE

Chris,

I think we hit the nail on the head on this one. After looking at the following links, I believe this is a "cored hull" without stringers. I was wondering what this type of hull is called, thanks. This should make the repair feasible!

http://www.fiberglassics.com/glassic-forums/main-forum/sandwich-construction-in-small-boats
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/141391/how_to_repair_a_damaged_balsa_core.html?cat=6


So now that I know whats going on, if I knew the answers to the following questions, I could start on this fix:
* Besides foam or Balsa wood, what else can I use to stuff in between the layers that would provide good buoyancy and would not be affected by future water intrusion?

* After I cut a big rectangle out of the floor area and finish the work there, should I reuse the same rectangle when I re-patch (resin + hardener + mat around the sides) the floor?

* If the answer to the previous question is yes, how many layers of mat should I use around the sides of the rectangle to ensure that I have a strong bond between the rectangle I cut out and the rest of the hull?


Thanks again to all!

Eyal, I think you are on to something. I had a '62 14' Crestliner, with a cored hull. The wood in the transom was balsa or some other light strong wood. It turned to mush, from getting wet. I repaired my boat, but It resulted in poor performance, and I cannot recommend it to you.

I cut the interior skin away, scooped out the rotten wood with my hands, until I got to wood that was reasonably strong. I then cut a 3/4" piece of plywood to fit the missing core. I cut a trapazoid shape to avoid the weak spot a rectangle would give. I supported the keel of the boat, and the bow, installed the plywood, and weighted it down with cement block to true the hull and stretch the exterior skin, and poured catalysed poly resin to fill all voids. New skin on the interior and on the bottom completed the repair.

After the repair the rear of the boat was strong and planed well on the aft (repaired) section. The unrepaired section was softer and tended to flop around, when you hit a wave.