An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

[JamieScott]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Thanks for you last few posts guys.

I'm getting closer now to getting it back together and the big test run in a tank.

I'm hoping that the water jackets are not blocked up as you are right the motor most likely has been used in salt water. If there's problems with the water flow then I will have to go deeper but I will cross my fingers that's not the case.

I've got all the bits that I need now and am going to try to get it back together tonight. All I have to do is connect up the shift rod to the shift rod lever - put in the new top of driveshaft o-ring and seal - put the powerhead back onto the exhaust hosing with a new gasket in place - reconnect the levers to the carby - attempt to get the lower gearcase housing section all lined up and back on. The only thing that's stopping me from testing it is after that is that I've not got a fuel tank or fuel line yet so that's going to slow things up.

There is a telltale on this motor. Its a small rubber pipe with a plastic pee hole on the end that exits just below the lower spark plug.

Will update soon

Jamie

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

If there is a "pee tube" on this motor, I believe it was added. Since most people don't operate a 6hp motor with remote steering and controls, having such a water flow indicator isn't necessary. All the operator has to do is to turn around a little bit and watch the water come out of the relief exhaust exit, at the midpoint of the exhaust housing.

 

[PW2]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

I have a 77 6 hp Johnson, and it does have a tell tale.

And as far as salt water flushing, I'd just run mine in the lake about once a year for an half hour or so, whether it needed it or not. I'm not recommending this method, mind you. Just saying what I did, and never had too much problem.

Now I had friends with small Mercs, and some used a little vinegar in a test barrel, others used Tide detergent. They always had trouble. Not sure if it had to do more with the black color of the motor, or their technique, but I was never very impressed with either.

 

[Theoutdoorsman]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Not sure if it had to do more with the black color of the motor, or their technique, but I was never very impressed with either.

Giggle........ ....... That was good!!!

Jamie, I'll do some digging on the various products of the flushing for you and see what I can come up with. I'll edit this post later and add them as I accumulate information. That way you can continue getting this thing together. We've all got our fingers crossed for you. Good luck!!!!!............ ALAN


EDIT: Some interesting reading for you Jamie.

http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=142907&highlight=Flushing+outboard+after+use+in+salt+water

http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=83053&highlight=Flushing+outboard+after+use+in+salt+water

http://www.saltawayproducts.com/ If not readily available to you in your area, you might check on eBay for this product, should you decide to use one.

 

[Harker]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Since the powerhead is off, you may be able to look up into the passages on the bottom and see what they look like.. I'm getting excited to hear that it runs!

 

[Theoutdoorsman]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Since the powerhead is off, you may be able to look up into the passages on the bottom and see what they look like.. I'm getting excited to hear that it runs!

Me too!!! Just be advised that you should be able to hold your hand on the head for several seconds before NEEDING to remove it, once running. If you can't, shut it down.

 

[JamieScott]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

If there is a "pee tube" on this motor, I believe it was added. Since most people don't operate a 6hp motor with remote steering and controls, having such a water flow indicator isn't necessary. All the operator has to do is to turn around a little bit and watch the water come out of the relief exhaust exit, at the midpoint of the exhaust housing.

I think this one's original as it's shown in the OMC manual that I got for this motor.

If the water flow is good how strong should the flow from the tell tale be?

Jamie

 

[JamieScott]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Since the powerhead is off, you may be able to look up into the passages on the bottom and see what they look like.. I'm getting excited to hear that it runs!

You're correct - I could see a small way up the water passages and they appear clear.

The good news is that I managed to get it all back together last night so now there's a complete unit sitting on the floor of our kitchen/my workshop (yes my wife has allowed me to work on the motor in the kitchen -what a woman! - She even held the unit in place while I put the powerhead back on!!! This must be true love!)

I managed to get the lower unit lined up and back on before I put the powerhead on so that made it easier in the end to get it all back together.

The bad news is that after work tonight I rushed to get to the local boating shop to buy the fuel tank and line only to find out that it had closed earlier than I thought it did! To add to that they're closed tomorrow as it's a public holiday!!! So now my big excitement all day about getting to pull it over in a test tank has ended in frustration!!!! They're open on Saturday so I will have to wait until then. So close and yet SO FAR!

If only I knew someone with a tank and fuel line but alas all my boating buddies are on this forum in cyberspace!

Thanks heaps guys for the support - If I get it running on Sat I'll buy you all a cyber beer!!

Jamie

 

[JamieScott]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Me too!!! Just be advised that you should be able to hold your hand on the head for several seconds before NEEDING to remove it, once running. If you can't, shut it down.

Thanks for the advice Alan - I will be sure to do this if it starts on Sat!

Thanks also for the info on salt water/ flushing. Seeing as I can do no more on the motor now I will have a good read of that tonight.

What do you think about sacrificial zincs? I've been reading about them from one of the books I got from the library and my unit doesn't appear to have any externally. Is this something that you can add on yourself? Maybe I should add this as a seperate post.

Jamie

 

[dimock44]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Hey Jamie
Here in Texas you can get a squeeze bulb at auto parts stores or Wal Mart and with a little hose rigged up from any gas can to test with. It would save the expense of a gas can and hose until you see if it runs. Good luck hope it runs

 

[Theoutdoorsman]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Hey Jamie
Here in Texas you can get a squeeze bulb at auto parts stores or Wal Mart and with a little hose rigged up from any gas can to test with. It would save the expense of a gas can and hose until you see if it runs. Good luck hope it runs

You should be able to pick up a 6 gallon can, pre-assembled with a hose and bulb, for around $20 at Wal-Mart. That is assuming you HAVE a Wal-Mart close by you in the land of OZ..... ....... In all your excitement, please don't forget to pre-mix the fuel before cranking her over......LOL. What does a cyber beer taste like?........ LOL. It has to feel absolutely great to finally see her in ONE piece!!! I'm starting to feel you excitement. Just for the record, I rebuilt the powerhead for my E'rude 140 in her dining room (MY workshop!)........ LOL. What can I say, worked for me. And you too I suppose. You better treat her to a night on the town for it though......She'll expect it...... ;-)

 

[JamieScott]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Hey Jamie
Here in Texas you can get a squeeze bulb at auto parts stores or Wal Mart and with a little hose rigged up from any gas can to test with. It would save the expense of a gas can and hose until you see if it runs. Good luck hope it runs

Hey, thanks for that idea - I had actually thought about trying this prior to your post and that night there was an auto parts store open and I went in to see if there was some alternative method of rigging up a test fuel system. My conclusion in the end was that I'm in it for the long haul with this engine so whatever is wrong with it I'm going to attempt to fix it and get it back up and on the water. With that in mind I decided that I would be patient and wait the extra day to get the tank and hose as eventually I will need them anyway.

Tomorrows the big test day then!!

Jamie

 

[JamieScott]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

You should be able to pick up a 6 gallon can, pre-assembled with a hose and bulb, for around $20 at Wal-Mart. That is assuming you HAVE a Wal-Mart close by you in the land of OZ..... ....... In all your excitement, please don't forget to pre-mix the fuel before cranking her over......LOL. What does a cyber beer taste like?........ LOL. It has to feel absolutely great to finally see her in ONE piece!!! I'm starting to feel you excitement. Just for the record, I rebuilt the powerhead for my E'rude 140 in her dining room (MY workshop!)........ LOL. What can I say, worked for me. And you too I suppose. You better treat her to a night on the town for it though......She'll expect it...... ;-)

Alan - Thanks for the info on Wal-Mart. We don't have it over here in Oz but we do have K-Mart and another chain called Big - W. You've got me thinking though... I'm sure that K-Mart have a boating section and they may well sell the tank and hose. The boat shop that I was going to go to has the tank and hose in stock but will be about $100 so in the morning I'm going to check out K-Mart and Big -W before I head to the boat shop. A good plan! Also... don't worry I've already got the 2 stroke oil!!

LOL at your workshop being the dining room!! Indeed what women we have!! She will get a night on the town - have no fear.

As to a cyber beer - I guess it tastes as good as you can possibly imagine it would! That would be the beauty of it - and cheap at half the price!

I will update tomorrow hopefully with some good news... We'll have to wait and see!

Jamie

 

[Theoutdoorsman]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

As to a cyber beer - I guess it tastes as good as you can possibly imagine it would! That would be the beauty of it - and cheap at half the price!

Ahhhhh....... I can taste it now!!! No wait.......that's a real one.......LOL

Just out of curiosity, did you rebuild the carb or are you going to try it as is first? Also, did you do a spark test to ensure you are definitely getting a good spark? Jumping a 7/16" gap in open air on a spark tester I hope? If you have good spark, good compression, and are getting fuel, this things going to run and make you smile for sure!!!! While your at K-Mart, pick up a spray bottle for some pre-mixed fuel. In case you need to use it to troubleshoot later, should you have trouble with the carb and the outboard won't keep itself running, this will surely save you another trip out. It will cost you every bit of a couple dollars. Too, if you don't need it for this purpose, you can simply use it to tidy things up a bit after enjoying your free rig!!! K-Mart should have that exact same fuel cell as our Wally World. Good luck and keep us posted!!!!!............... ALAN

 

[JamieScott]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

GOOD NEWS - we have lift off (well not exactly lift off but we have life!)

I've had the most hectic weekend as some friends from the UK are over on holiday and we've been doing the tour guide thing showing them around. I managed to buy the tank and fuel hose on Sat. I got them from the boat shop in the end as K-Mart didn't have much of a boating section.

I didn't have a moment spare to rig it all up until this morning (Monday) when I had a spare 45 mins. It's all I've thought about all weekend though!

I rigged it all up and mixed the 2 stroke in the tank then clamped it to the bin full with water - primed the bulb and then pulled her over quite a few times before finally she reluctantly kicked into life!! Then she stalled out on me and it took a good few pulls again and playing around with the throttle/choke to get her to fire up again.

The first time it started I was so excited that I forgot to properly look at the tell tale so I had a few minutes of dread while I tried to get her started thinking that the water wasn't going to be flowing properly. When I got it started again I found to my delight that the tell tale was pumping water nicely and the powerhead seemed to be cool enough in all sections to indicate that the water flow is strong enough. It didn't run it for long enough to really test the temperature but I didn't want to run it for too long as there was a small fuel leak from the plastic outer casing of the fuel pump. Not a constant leak (don't all freak out!) Mainly when you prime the bulb then there was a very fine jet of fuel leaking out the little cover that holds the filter on this model. I think because of this leak the pressure in the system would not be running smoothly anyway which may be part of the reason that it was so difficult to get it started.

There's a question for you... If you had a leak in the system would it mean that you can't get it primed properly as the fuel would just return to the tank when you stop pumping the bulb (I hope that makes sense??!!)

Anyway, so it will need a good tune up and in answer to Alans post prior to this I haven't rebuilt the Carby so that's something that I will aim to do. I just decided to hold off on doing this until I knew if the engine was pumping water smoothly and would even start! I'm going to replace the plastic cover to the fuel pump and then start it again and go from there. As soon as I finish this post I'm going to call the boat shop down the road and see if they have that plastic cover in stock.

The great news really is that it has water pumping, the gears engage no problem and the ignition system's working so other than a tune up and carby service this motor for free looks like it's going to do the job!

Thanks to all for your help so far!!
We're nearly there!!!! I can almost smell the sweet smell of success!!!

Jamie

 

[Theoutdoorsman]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

What type of fuel pump do you have? Might you simply need to replace a seal? I'm sure you've looked at the first two posts in the forum for some good diagrams on fuel pumps. To the best of my knowledge, your manual probably doesn't have any exploded diagrams of the pump available. Also, you may try to tighten the screws to ensure your getting a good seal. Might just be something simple unless you have phyisically inspected the pump and saw a crack in the plastic housing. I'd be willing to bet that you need to remove, clean, and reinstall the carb though. Hard telling how long it's been since this motor was run last. After all, you did find it in a trash pile on the side of the road, and in two pieces..... ........ That's got to tell you something. Glad you got it running!!!! Now to fine tune it and get it on that free "blimpy"!!! You gonna name that rig......... Freebird? .........

 

[jbjennings]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

The primer bulb has check valves to prevent the fuel from flowing back to the tank..Outdoorsman is right as usual--If there's no cracks on the fuel pump housing then an o-ring or tightening the screw should fix the problem as well as a new housing and be a lot cheaper. A new fuel pump is expensive! A fuel pump rebuild kit isn't that high. The carb is almost definitely dirty so between the 2 problems, you should have that rascal fixed. I've been looking forward to hearing you run it! I hope you can post some running pics.
Later,
JBJ

 

[Theoutdoorsman]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Once you get that carb rebuilt and the outboard is idling fine, don''t forget to do the decarb. This will flush any carbon buildup from within and likely free up those rings. Afterwards, do another compression test and see if your compression doesn't slightly increase. Others here have attested to an easier initial start amongst other possitive results!!! Speaking of which, what is your starting proceedure exactly, step by step, as you are starting the outboard? The hard starting could be something simple as well............... ALAN

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

The proper fuel pump for that motor should be the small, square unit that is about 2" on each dimension. Cost for a new one in the U.S. is about $78!

You can buy a rebuild kit and it should come with complete instructions. None-the-less, pay close attention to where everything goes as you take it apart because they are more complicated that you might imagine, for something so small.

 

[JamieScott]

Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Really good to hear from you guys again and so quickly as usual!

I think I may have confused you all by my description of the part that was leaking fuel - I re-read my post and I worded it wrong - sorry. It's the plastic cover that holds the wire mesh fuel filter so not the actual fuel pump housing - just the plastic fuel filter cover that the fuel first enters before going through into the fuel pump. It's strange that is has this very small pin hole in it?? You can't even really see the hole (maybe crack) when you look at it but under pressure it was pushing out a jet of petrol when you pumped the bulb - not when the engine was running just when you go to prime it.

I've been back down the road to the boat shop and like so many of the parts that I've needed for this project they had the part in stock! I got it and a new rubber gasket that goes between it and the pump for $7 all up so not too expensive at all. I've fitted it back on the motor all ready to go but as I live in a block of apartments it's too noisy to be running the engine outside after about 7pm and by the time I got back from work it was getting too late.

I hope to get a chance to rigg it all up again tomorrow evening and try to run it to see if it will start better this time - I still know that I'm going to be looking at a carby service - just curious really to see it running anyway.

As to how I went about starting it Alan .... I primed the bulb but as I said on the previous post there was a fine jet of fuel spirting out of the filter cover each time you pushed the bulb once the pressure started to build up - this made me hesitate from pumping it too much. I pulled the choke fully out and set the throttle to the position on it which showed start so about 3/4 on. I then pulled it over quite a few times but then pushed the choke back in so as not to flood it too much and kept pulling it over and she kicked into life. I'm hoping that it will be smoother next time when I can prime the bulb fully without the fear of petrol spirting out onto the engine. I will let you know

The other thing I want to check is the spark plug gap that I should have set for the plugs that are fitted. I haven't replaced them as they both look new but I also haven't checked the gap as I'm not sure what it should be. In my manual it shows that the plugs for this motor should be (Actual wording) "Champion L78V or AC M40FFK then as an alternative it suggests L77J4 or AC M40FFX gapped at 0.040" (1.0 mm)".

The actual plugs that are in the motor are - L77JC4 - is the "C" going to make a difference or is this the same as L77J4? Also does that info from the manual mean that whichever plugs you choose they should be gapped at 0.040" (1.0mm) or does it mean that the AC M40FFX ones should be this gap.

I want to make sure that I get it right!

Thanks guys

Jamie