Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

Dothedew

Cadet
Joined
May 17, 2010
Messages
21
Good Day all. New to the forum and have already answered lots of questions. But I've still got a few more.

Recently bought a 1983 Doral bought from a couple from the nearest town. This is our first 'real' boat, and we wanted something we could use and run right away with only a little work. We found this one for just under 3K. It appeared to be well maintained, the owner's father-in law was a mechanic and always replaced something before it needed replacing, oil, cables, whatever. Seemed like honest nice people. Hull was in good shape, not hardly a scratch, no nicks, dings or black marks. There is some light maintence that needs to be done, trim needs to be stained, carpet replaced, little timbits, nothing major, (or so it appeared). Engine cover was lifted to reveal a clean engine compartment. Engine paint was still adhering, all wiring was clean, solenoids were new, everything looked as it should. All systems work, bilge, lights, blower fans, etc.

We brought it home, and put it in the water for the first time. Started like a top, idled nice. However when we put it into gear, the engine would begin to rev slightly, before jumping into gear. This could be avoided by a sharp rasp in the control before the engine could rev, however it made for a real pain when trying to load back on the trailer. When it was in gear, it pulled and ran great, no noises, clunking, just worked as it should. However in reverse, it would go into gear, but barely idle, almost stall like the engine was cutting out under the load, but wouldn't accelerate. I suspect that (after looking at the linkage) that one of the microswitches had something to do with this.

Suspecting that it was a cable adjustment for the gear unit, I took it to the local marina to have it set properly. A day later they called and charged 64.00 for 30 minutes of labor to adjust it. They said it was way out of wack, but should work fine now. We put it back in the water, backed off the trailer and tried to pull foward into the dock. There was no foward gear. Reverse worked fine now, would go into reverse and rev fine, but no foward whatsoever now. Foward advancement of the throttle would accel the engine with the slight whine/howl of gears just about to mesh, but not quite, as if it was almost in gear, just not quite there.

Now that I've explained the life story, my questions are.

What type of rear unit do I have?
I believe its a stringer 800, but I am not sure. Its not a cobra, as I asked the marina, they said no, and cannot find a decal of one anywhere on it.

Which engine do I have? I didn't take a picture, but its says OMC on the manifold, is an inline four, 2 bbl carb, likely original. I'll see if I can take a picture tomorrow if need be.

What is going on with the gear selection? Gear selection is made by a cable from the thottle. This cable goes to a plate that sits on the top rear of the engine. It has degree markings and microswitches on it. It moves a something inside a case that must be attached to the lower unit, or so I assume. What is the right way to adjust this? Its hit or miss if done by hand. If you slowly move the controls foward the prop will lock up eventually, but if you repeat the process, once in a while the prop will spin freely, as if in neutral, leading me to suspect the marina didn't set something up right.

I've taken it back to the marina, but am from a small town where they are the only business in town and have the 'we're the only ones in town' attitude, and am getting the vibe they and screwing with me. Appreciate any input. I'll take more pictures if requested. Thanks for reading my noval.
:confused:
 

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cr2k

Captain
Joined
Mar 19, 2009
Messages
3,730
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

You have a Stringer Mount. The plate in the back is called the converter, it takes the push/pull from the shift cable and converts it to a pull/pull system via the cables inside the black rubber cable that goes thru the tramsom plate to the outdrive. There are a few more steps to take the box apart. If you get to this PM me and I will point you in the right direction.

Look for the service manual link in the Stickys at the top of this forum.

There are 2 cables in there run over some pulleys and operated by a quadrant. If the cables get twisted (would not do their own, would have to be put back together wrong) your shifting will be way messed up and often hard to operate.

To adjust: In driveway or where ever, disconnect shift cable (not the rubber one, the one from the throttle/shift box by the helm)
reach around and give the rubber cable a good pull to make sure it is seated.
start engine run at idle. shift one way all the way into gear. Mark this position. Go the other way and mark this position. Now center the arm between the 2 marks. This is Neutral. Now adjust the shift cable to fit on the pin in this position.

This can also be done engine off with someone helping by moving the prop to ensure full engagement.

I have also done by running engine and moving just until you hear the shift dogs touching. In fact if you do this after you set the engaged setting this will give you Nominal Neutral. And you will be able to see by any gross differences between engaged and just touching marks if there is any problems going to F or R.

One thing you NEED to do often like every outing or 2 is drain the little gear box that runs the drive tilt and refill with oil. This is the Tilt Clutch Box and they are notorious for leaking. One screw on the side and one on the bottom. If left to fill with water the oil is pushed up into the tilt motor and messes it up. They cost about $250 plus labor (which is a real PITA)
 

flockshot

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Dec 21, 2009
Messages
37
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

Assuming your drive system is original you have a OMC Stringer 400. The 800 is for 8 cylinder engines and the 400 is for 4 cylinder engines.
There were two 4 cylindar engines in 1983. The 2.5 litre and 3.0 litre. The 2.5 is 120 hp and the 3.0 is 140 hp. There are not a lot of differences in normal maintenance on these two engines.
I have a 1983 400 stringer with a 3.0 and am learning just like you are.
The maintenance book(s), as mentioned in the previous post, are a must have. I have the Seloc, Climers, OMC stern drive parts catalog, and have ordered the OMC Service Manual.
Your local marine folks may work on this unit for you, but that doesn't mean they know what they are doing.
There are people on this forum that do know what they are talking about and as you read the threads you will get a lot of valuable information.
 

Dothedew

Cadet
Joined
May 17, 2010
Messages
21
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

Thanks for the replies everyone. I will certainly check out the service manuals sections and see what needs to be done.

cr2k. I've already done as you say. I disconnected the gear cable that comes from the throttle quadrant. I tested it by itself, and moves very easily. The converter I believe is the problem. Even moving by hand is extremely difficult, not impossible, just a lot of resistance, as if this second pull/pull cable you are talking about is dried up. Are these servicable? Or adjustable? I believe this is the only issue, but I'd like some more info as to how or what to do to aid in fixing the problem before the marina calls with a big bill. Thanks.
 

Dothedew

Cadet
Joined
May 17, 2010
Messages
21
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

Forget to ask, where are the plugs for the tilt clutch box? Outside or inboard? Flat headed screws similar to the lower unit?
 

Howard Sterndrive

Rear Admiral
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
4,603
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

tilt clutch plugs outside- same plugs as lower unit
one on side, one on bottom

bummer if it's the lower shift cable.

They are $713.13 Canadian
 

flockshot

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Dec 21, 2009
Messages
37
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

They are about 250 on Ebay. They aren't always listed but that is what they have been going for.
 

Howard Sterndrive

Rear Admiral
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Messages
4,603
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

I don't even see any in completed items...

OP you have a pm
 

Dothedew

Cadet
Joined
May 17, 2010
Messages
21
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

Well I took it back to the Marina for a second time, in hopes that they would come up with something a little better. Not sure exactly what they did, but one of the apprentices told me the adjustment was to much one way, as I now had reverse only, and no foward. He said they greased all the cables, and should work fine now. Put in into the lake today, and worked like a charm...for about 15 minutes.

We had both gears to begin with, both went in and out very smoothly, but is wasn't long before reverse just 'went away'. Sharp snap in the throttle quadrant would sometimes put it in gear, but also blipping the throttle, which is only asking for something to get broken. We beached and I pulled the cover off to see what was going on. The gear lever was moving on top of the converter box, and all seemed to be going where it should. There was a small plastic knob for length of cable adjustment, so I screwed it one direction for a while, and tried again. Bingo. Reverse worked great. No foward.

Went back the other direction. Got foward back, no reverse. So, aimed for somewhere in the middle, and reverse is almost there, but its very lightly in gear, as you can hear/feel. Thought I had it figured out (somewhat releaved it wasn't more serious) and headed to dock. However as we began to load onto the trailer, I went into reverse, but way to easily. Tried foward, also easy, now with only throttle control. The rear of the drive cable was still there, so I'm assuming it must have come apart at the quadrant. It was dark when we got home, so I haven't a chance to look or tear it apart.

I'm done with Marina. I'm a hands on guy, but this boating stuff is new to me, and perhaps I'm making it out to be more complicated than it is. This is the first time we've paid a good chunk of change on something, and am afraid to break it, as I've read nothing good about the 400 stringers. So back to the problem. Something must be moving for it to be in adjustment, and then out of. I do not believe its the rear of the drive cable, so I'm assuming its in the quadrant, which is going to be a pain to take apart. Is there adjustibility there as well?

Also like to thank howard, I found the tilt plugs, one on top, next to transom, other below on side. I drained and sure enough, was milky white. Also drained the upper and lower unit gear boxes, which we better. I was reading that the gear boxes use gear oil (75-90, or whatever), but the tilt box was suppose to be a lighter oil, such as 30 weight. When I drained it, the stuff came out was thicker than gear oil, so it definately wasn't a high viscous oil. I replaced it with 80-90. I assume its only gears, so I can't see it hurting anything. Am i wrong? Are these suppose to be filled from the bottom up as well, just like the lower unit?
 

SSSuper83

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Feb 23, 2010
Messages
132
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

Great thread for the OMC oldies.
 

Howard Sterndrive

Rear Admiral
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Nov 5, 2008
Messages
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Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

I assume its only gears, so I can't see it hurting anything. Am i wrong? Are these suppose to be filled from the bottom up as well, just like the lower unit?
not even gears... just a worm drive and clutch. 85/90 fine in there.
bottom up fine.
many fill with grease because of inherent water intrusion into that compartment.
 

Dothedew

Cadet
Joined
May 17, 2010
Messages
21
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

I assume they leak (tilt box) due to bad seals. Can they not be renewed with some new seals, or is this just a design problem, or both that allows so much intrusion?
 

Dothedew

Cadet
Joined
May 17, 2010
Messages
21
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

Also curious on telling the difference between the 4 cylinders. I read on another thread about the balancers being different, 3.0 had vibration dampeners, and 2.5's had a solid one (No rubber bushing). Is this correct? It is a GM block, as indicated by the markings on the block, but all the stickers and whatnot on the valve cover were painted over.
 

Dothedew

Cadet
Joined
May 17, 2010
Messages
21
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

Well, I've found part of the problem. Shift cable via quadrant is moving, converter moves to freely. Pulled the screws out to lift the cover off. Cables still attached to pulleys, however one was loose and free, and I was able to pull it out of the lower cable cord. The end is fraid. Now what? Does the lower unit have to be removed to repair this?
 

Dothedew

Cadet
Joined
May 17, 2010
Messages
21
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

Just read through one of the service manuals. Going by what it says, the entire drive unit must be removed in order for the cable to be replaced, even the exhaust manifold. Just seems like an awful lot of work for only a cable to be replaced. Its step by step in the manual, to it should be straight foward, however I'm a little concerned about the special service tools that are required. I'm fairly mechanically inclined, I've rebuilt engines and restored cars, so I'm not afraid of a little grease and grit, but this is a new procedure for me. I'd prefer......../cannot afford to have the marina do it for me, so I'd rather do it myself. Has anyone done this before, personally? I've got enough space to work with, a garage for cover, tools to use, and a chain hoist good enough to lift the unit. Should I attempt this, or save the cash for the marina to do it? I've attached a couple of pictures, just for something to look at.
 

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superbenk

Commander
Joined
Oct 27, 2008
Messages
2,033
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

Looks like the 140 to me. Here's mine from a 1980 Century 190:

main.php


I'm a little curious what the microswitches on the shift converter box are for? I don't have those at all:

main.php


Is that something that came after 1980?
 

Howard Sterndrive

Rear Admiral
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Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

I'm a little curious what the microswitches on the shift converter box are for? I don't have those at all:
Is that something that came after 1980?
your 1980 is a hydromechanical shift
1982 and later were full mechanical shift
switches are part of the ESA system found on full mech units
 

Dothedew

Cadet
Joined
May 17, 2010
Messages
21
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

I believe (from what I've read here) is that they are ignition interuption switches that slow/alter the ignition so that gear selection can be easily made without harming transmission parts and make gear changes easier. Since this is a mechanical switch unit, or so I believe, I can believe that. There seems to be a lot of adjustment for the switches.
 

Howard Sterndrive

Rear Admiral
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4,603
Re: Bought a new boat (to me), what do I have?

Going by what it says, the entire drive unit must be removed in order for the cable to be replaced, even the exhaust manifold. Just seems like an awful lot of work for only a cable to be replaced.
I can have the drive off and on the bench in under 15 minutes, but I've done a few... if you are a wrench twister, budget an hour or so and take your time.

I see no reason to remove the exhaust manifold... especially if you aren't trying to save the old cable.

In one pic, you have bare cable laying on the engine- bad idea if the battery is in the boat.

There are lots of bare 12V+ connections on relays and such that a cable like that can hit and fry stuff up.

take the battery clear out of the boat before doing any stringer shift cable removal
 
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