Buick V6 conversion

[4bait]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

Andy,

You need a shift interrupt switch on that shift plate. If you don't have one there, you'll destroy the dog clutch in the gearcase, and there's a good chance you'll break either of the shift cables.

Chris.....

AH now I know what the spring thingy was on the old 470 one LOL I thought it was just there for the start neutral switch which isn't needed on this one, The old 470 one also had a hydraulic valve for the tilt trim which the new tilt trim doesn't have or need

Good point and thankyou I will make a change to it as it won't take long to re-configure a bit.

Cheers Andy

 

[achris]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

... The old 470 one also had a hydraulic valve for the tilt trim which the new tilt trim doesn't have or need....

That was a 'reverse lock valve' which, as you have already realized, you don't need with the new trim pump...

Be careful with the old interrupt switch.... Don't break it, they are NLA...

Cheers.....

 

[scipper77]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

You my friend are an AMAZING talent!! My favorite part is that you made an oil filter relocation adapter out of a coffee can and scrap metal. And it looks better than most oem parts.

Are you going to add a Mr. Fusion to that thing?? LOL

As we all know, these restoration projects are often fueled with beer.

 

[4bait]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

You my friend are an AMAZING talent!! My favorite part is that you made an oil filter relocation adapter out of a coffee can and scrap metal. And it looks better than most oem parts.

Are you going to add a Mr. Fusion to that thing?? LOL No but A flux Capacitor could be an option LOL

As we all know, these restoration projects are often fueled with beer.Yes there has been a bit of that fuel used during this project

Ok I have redone the old mercruiser shift plate so it now fits where I wanted it.
I ended up using a combination of the one I built along with the old one and put the 2 together so I now have the shift interupt function on it.
Thankyou Achris for that peice of advise and info.

Photo to come on the weekend when I install it back in the boat.



Over the last few days I have been working on the cooling system, and put together a new header tank.

I went to the wrecker to see what cars had a header tank that would suit the application and the only one that did have something suitable was a Ford Falcon. Grrrrrrrrrrrrr
Out of principle I could not put a ford part on the boat and being a true devoted Holden person probably never will LOL.
So I went to the old car section and cut the filler cap neck out of an old brass radiator so I had something to weld into a new header tank for the radiator cap to fit onto.

Roy came over on the weekend and helped out with the header tank position and bracketing and his advice was very much appreciated.


We also decided the old 470 Mercruiser heat exchanger was not configured well for the area I wanted to put it and I would have needed a mile of pipe work to plumb it in.

So it was decided to have a crack at building a custom heat exchanger.

First job was to decided the exact placement in the boat and work out where pipes were going to be routed so the length and shape and size could be decided.

Then it was time to drill two end plates, cut the stainless tube length, and cut up nearly 30 meters of 1/4 inch copper tube.

The copper tube was silver soldered into the end plates to make the inner core; the core was then silvered into the tube.
I had a little trouble with the copper distorting due to the heat needed for the silver but that was over come and the copper tubes were all braced together internally to minimise movement internally.

2 end caps were then turned up out of some old solid brass irrigation fittings and fitted with seals to complete the heat exchanger.

heres a pic with the header tank fitted and power steering resivoir below that and at the very bottom the heat exchanger just sitting inplace ready to be bracketed in.

I have no doubt the heat exchanger will work but how well only a good test run will tell, at least it will give me a starting point and if need be there is room to fit another 30 pipes in it if more cooling is needed.

Cheers Andy

 

[achris]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

Amazingly great job Andy.... What are you using to pickle the SS welds?

Cheers,

Chris......

 

[4bait]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

Amazingly great job Andy.... What are you using to pickle the SS welds?

Cheers,

Chris......

Hi chris

I have a hydrofluoric (think that?s how it's spelt) acid bath at work and a dip in that seems to clean them up pretty good, works a treat on the silver and the copper too and also removed the exsess silver flux.
The bath isn't anything special its just an 80 litre sqaure plastic tub.

Sodium Fluoride works well too from what i hear

When all is finished I have a sales rep who is going to lend me a handy little device that has an electrolysis brush on the end and it runs through a Dc inverter, you just run the brush over the welds and it brings the nickel to the to the surface and there is then no need for polishing, It's an amazing little tool. If it didn't cost $3000 for a base model or I would get one.

Cheers Andy

 

[achris]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

Hi chris

I have a hydrofluoric (think that?s how it's spelt) acid bath

Yep, that's the usual stuff welders use... Unfortunately because of the extremely dangerous nature of hydrofluoric acid it's illegal for people without a permit to buy it (it is here anyway).

...Sodium Fluoride works well too from what i hear

I'll give that a try...

When all is finished I have a sales rep who is going to lend me a handy little device that has an electrolysis brush on the end and it runs through a Dc inverter, you just run the brush over the welds and it brings the nickel to the to the surface and there is then no need for polishing, It's an amazing little tool. If it didn't cost $3000 for a base model or I would get one.

Cheers Andy

I believe the normal pickle/passivating mix is 5% hydrofluoric and 5% Nitric acid. I think the Nitric does the job of bringing the nickel up to the surface. I have a welder friend and he'll pickle small jobs for me, but when the ladder is attached to a 25' boat it's a bit hard to take to his workshop. When he does it he wears all sorts of PPE, rubber boot, rubber apron, goggles, big thick rubber gloves and a breathing filter! Apparently he like his bones just the way they are.

Chris.............

 

[4bait]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

MMMM I'm actually now having a few dramas with the heat exchanger.

It all looks good but when pressure tested I?m getting just a couple of leaks, so I reweld it then it leaks somewhere else. I have now done this 6 or 7 times. I think I've got it sealed now but time will tell.

What seems to be happening is the stainless expands and contracts at a different rate to the copper and the silver, and as the welding heats and cools it, the leaks are appearing. I have welded it again and cooled the whole thing slowly in an oven so the temperature comes down more evenly so heres hoping but so far so good.

If all else fails I will have to do another but maybe the next time out of a 4 inch copper tube instead of the stainless.

If this one does eventually seal then it should be fine as it won't be getting as much heat when in use

Cheers Andy

 

[achris]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

...What seems to be happening is the stainless expands and contracts at a different rate to the copper and the silver, and as the welding heats and cools it, the leaks are appearing. ...

This may explain why all the OEM heat exchangers are copper.... Seems logical.

Chris.....

 

[4bait]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

Today has been a big day and I now feel like I'm getting somewhere.
I am definitely starting to get excited anyway.

Up until now it has been very slow because every time I worked on a particular area I could only go so far as one thing would interrupt the next bit and so on, as a result had to keep getting things ready in advance like a big Jigsaw puzzle.

But today all the little bits have started coming together and certain parts are now finished. Like the throttle linkages, Gear linkages, Cooling system has been filled and pressure tested, Exhaust is all hooked up, power steering is finished, Fuel pump and fuel lines are fitted and the fuel system has been primed and pressurized, Just got to put the return line into the tank and clamp the lines into place etc,

Also today I got the old kill tank converted to a battery box (Just got to flow coat it)
Also the gear linkages modified to include an interrupt switch that I was told I needed (thanks Achris). I ended up using a combination of the old Mercruiser shift plate and my home made one and put the 2 together so it still fitted in the designated spot. Not as pretty as the other one but it will do what it has to.

The next job is to start on the wiring and hopefully over the weekend if I get enough time, I will here her run for the first time. (daughter Kates Birthday Saturday so that rules that day out)

I think I have also found a good way to join copper and stainless without the warpage from heat. The stainless tins nicely with the silver and the lead sticks to the silver and the copper pretty well at a lower temp. Lead wont stick to Stainless without the silver.
hope that makes some sence.

Cheers Andy

 

[achris]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

...I think I have also found a good way to join copper and stainless without the warpage from heat. The stainless tins nicely with the silver and the lead sticks to the silver and the copper pretty well at a lower temp. Lead wont stick to Stainless without the silver.
hope that makes some sense...

Works for me. (same as chroming brass.... Chrome won't stick to brass, so they use copper (I think) as an intermediary)

 

[4bait]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

Well heres a quick Video of it running. Still have heaps to do as I have only done enough wiring to make it start for a test.

Had it running for about 1 hour today the only real issue I have noticed so far is that the Starboard Exhaust manifold gets hot at the top much more than the port side and is almost to hot to touch.
Reason I think is that I have the outlets too big and the manifold is not filling all the way to the top, It will be an easy fix to weld the end up a little more to create a restriction.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wEwoXh58hHo

Cheers Andy

 

[triman]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

I wish I'd been there for the first kick in the guts, but had I left home on Mother's Day, life as I know it would cease to exist.

This thread just gets better and better - now if I can find a Rolls Royce Merlin I may have another challenge for you.

Cheers!!!!!

 

[achris]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

Who needs thru-hulls when you have a sound like that coming from the reliefs...

Sounds really nice... Great job.

Personally, I wouldn't try to block up the exhaust water jacket. Once that thing gets moving you are going to want all the flow you can get. I also wouldn't worry too much about one side getting hotter. that's standard for the factory exhausts too...

Chris......

 

[4bait]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

MMMm I just re-checked my spec sheets and found that this engine from the Holden VS is rated at 196 hp I always thought it was only 170 hp but that was for the model before it.

So in a nutshell I may be pleasantly surprised with the extra power increase.

If I load the computer chip with a VT Holden programme then it will be 206 hp at 5200 rpm with max torque at 3600 rpm.

Not sure I want the motor revving at 5200rpm all the time though but something to think about and play with




Cheers Andy

 

[4bait]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

.
Today I chopped up the engine box cover and took nearly a foot off its length; it is amazing how much room it has created in the boat.

Before I could only get to the bait board from the sides but now I can stand at the front of it as well.
With the rear seats removed and the smaller engine box, the boat now has quite allot of fishing space.

I still need to rub the gelcoat back and blend the colour in better but in this cold weather I was having trouble getting the gelcoat to go off hence the heater sitting beside it.


Also since the old kill tank is now the battery box I have made a different passenger seat frame out of alloy for a new portable 1.2 meter long icebox type kill tank to sit underneath.

The rear seats and back rests are just sitting there at the moment to play with idea's

Just got to refit the 2way radios and wire up the bilge blower and shift interupt switch and then I can feel a water test coming on.

Even put the snapper racks, burely pot and Auxillary motor bracket back on today so it is getting closer.


Cheers Andy

 

[achris]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

A suggestion for your rear seats... I have a couple of table clips set up on the side of the engine box and a couple of seat squabs. Need a seat? I just clip it in, the other end of the seat sits on the side pocket board. Want to fish? take the seat out and it's like it was never there.

Chris......
(I guess you want photos?)

 

[4bait]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

A quick question which is not terribly important but more curious.

Do all the Mercruiser interrupt switches normally just short to earth??
The 470 one I have here on the boat is normally open circuit and when activated it closes and shorts to earth which is fine for an old coil based ignition system like the 470 but not for an EFI engine like the one I have put in.

I can hook a relay up to the existing switch and make it work in the way I need it to, but just thought if a later model worked the opposite and is normally closed, opposed to open then that would be better than putting in extra relays etc.

I had a look at JayCar electronics and DickSmiths etc but they don't have a micro switch the correct size, all theirs are heaps smaller.
If all else fails I will use the existing one and just put a relay in

Cheers Andy

 

[mariner1900]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

Hi!! Not all interrupts switch to ground. I have a 3.0 litre with EST ignition and the interrupt appears to break power to the dist. Download service manual #25, for the later V6 engines. This has the wiring diagrams for EFI engines.

DSE and Jaycar are only really good for hobby stuff. For industrial types of switches and if you need a normally closed switch try John R Turk as I know they carry a range of similar switches. Failing that RS components also carry a huge range of switches. RS in Melb http://australia.rs-online.com/web/generalDisplay.html?id=aboutRS&file=tc#melbourne . We use RS for quite a lot of switches, relays, etc for the ships I work on.

 

[4bait]

Re: Buick V6 conversion

thanks for that.

The only way I think I can do this is cut power to either the injectors or the DFI module and for this I need a switch that is normally closed opossed to normally open, either that or a relay operating of the existing switch.

I'll give that mob a try and see what they have

cheers andy