can of worms?

[88evinrude]

it is; or well, it's coming along...... but I'm not!! :lol: It's killin me lol, nibbling away every day is the only way I can approach a job this size - if it were steel, I'd been done in a week, no joke.

yeah i know how ya feel.

 

[jrttoday]

thanks for the musical interlude lol, but I hardly need reason to break - been on break since before I started. Past few days too humid to glass and I need get the gusset(s) and transom capped - was waiting to be in glassing mode and get other things figured out and done...
If I learned anything from building this boat six years ago, it was that "EVERYTHING AFFECTS EVERYTHING!!!" --- where I put this affects where I put that; how I do this affects how I do that. The hip bone's connected to..... lol

Glass Guy stopped by the other day and said - can't remember exactly how he started? - "......... that whole transom would come out"
what?
"you'll feel it and hear it, look back and the entire back of your boat will be gone"
what are you talking about?
"I've heard how you run the Ditch" :facepalm: :lol:

There's a few of 'em and they average 10/15' depth, but full of fallen trees and brush, often floating logs etc and other boats. There's only one time I threw caution to the wind; my buddy had been bitten by something? on his foot and was feeling very sick and was swelling.
You know how it is.... people see you do something without knowing why, and assume............

 

[jrttoday]

if pretty work is a requirement, I'll set back and watch ya'll
http://[URL=http://s173.photobucket.com/user/jrttoday/media/DSCF0003_zps0r1hrjea.jpg.html]

glassed all three at one time and goofed right off the bat!! Dropped the full cap of hardener in the resin :facepalm: TOO HOT!!! and scrambled to get 'em done; should have pitched it and started again. Came out OK, but missed some minor air.[/URL]

 

[jrttoday]

Now that it's staring me in the face!!! Like everything else, has been for awhile.... Part of floatation foam's purpose is to add strength to the hull. If I just lay Styrofoam in there or use jugs, it won't. Between the keel and P&S stringers, I added two layers of 24oz for extra support for gusset; and also double wrapped keel with 24oz.

Additionally, the inner skin is tabbed 12" to hull overtop that from top of of gunwale to top of gunwale. But am wondering about the hull - is that enough? or should I get my hands on some FF?

 

[Woodonglass]

Uhhmmm not totally true. Sheet foam, If layed in on edge and wedged in tight between the deck and the hull will in fact add to the structural strength of the hull.

 

[sphelps]

Yep , Woody's correct .. It takes a good bit of measuring and cutting but if installed nice and snug it adds good strength .
Just make sure you use the blue closed cell foam ... The white stuff will absorb water ..

 

[jrttoday]

yea... the problem I've got is the deck is not flat there. My old a'' angle finder recently crapped out, guessing 25* - in any case, difficult to cut Styrofoam (which is white; guess i could paint it blue?)

I have enough extra 24 to add several layers, but thinking that wouldn't be the same???

Am also finding out that masking tape is crap if used with fiberglass; and that the expensive 3M Duct tape is crap for what it's meant for. BUT!! works real well for masking glass. Its thick back skin and worthless glue make it ideal :lol:

 

[Woodonglass]

Hmmmm, so are you saying you ARE using the White Styrofoam for your Under Deck Flotation???

 

[jrttoday]

:lol: beige, off white, yellowish???? two part mix nasty stuff!! is what's in there. All that I have presently is 2" Industrial Board? insulation or whatever?
This is the first headache I've had with this project - and is a 2BC one at that! Thought I had this handled and never gave it another thought til now :facepalm:

i'm not wanting to go with foam for a couple reasons
will have to do something for drainage because it expands - which may be the bottom line? Have little control over how it turns out.
the cost for such a small area and what will I actually gain?

I've toyed with the idea of using laundry detergent jugs; they will fit the way the deck is going back. But offer no support. Am considering the practicality of making a honeycombed piece out of fiberglass to glass to the hull. Haven't figured it out exactly, but 1" tall or less. Drainage around or through that, no problem... can be taken care of before I seal it up

 

[sphelps]

Any ridged foam you might put in there needs to be closed cell or I would just leave it out ... If you was close buy I could give ya enough of the blue stuff to do your whole boat .... It's a little pricey in the stores ...

 

[jrttoday]

closed cell, that was the term, and that's what's in her. It was pricy then and I haven't checked recently. Not going there today! no need' - it's all dry.
The fact remains... I'd not considered all that floatation foam does and not having it back there. The last foot of hull is stronger than it ever was as it is, but still became an afterthought; the role FF has and possible flexing of that foot.
No engineer here, but the forces of water at speed...... nuff said

Tapering the deck up instead of down came late in the game; I can put almost 4 gallons of air in there. Am leaning that way; plus several layers of 24 or a honeycombed piece? Tedious to make!!! lol
Floatation Foam and fishing license; you only need 'em IF......

 

[jrttoday]

Any ridged foam you might put in there needs to be closed cell or I would just leave it out ... If you was close buy I could give ya enough of the blue stuff to do your whole boat .... It's a little pricey in the stores ...

ridged got me thinking :facepalm: this isn't a cigarette boat, but... imho. the smaller a craft the more important little things are to overall performance. And this is also a very small area at the final point of contact to the water. Inward flexing would create drag; e.g., have experienced that with my 12' aluminum - braced with struts inside and took care of it.

Ridged!! when the weather cooperates again, 3or4 plies of 24oz to make a sheet to cut 1" or so strips a foot long. Glassed to hull, standing to make 1" tall ribs that are glassed over with 24. Running longitudinally, they won't hold water.
PS: If I wuz close by, I might had you or WOG do the whole thing!!!! but know I couldn't afford it..........

 

[sphelps]

If you just want to stiffen the hull you can cut empty paper towel tubes in half and stick them to the bottom and glass over them ..
Just another option to consider ...

 

[jrttoday]

^^^ this had better work!! If not, I'm out $5 for an eight pack of cheap towels :lol:

 

[jrttoday]

paper towel tube, who'd a thought? Can't remember when I last bought paper towels, don't use 'em.
http://



two tubes, each side between the chine ridge with 24oz cover. Didn't do between port/keel/starboard stringers because there's already 4 layers of 24oz in there and the hull is thicker in the center anyway. Gusset was looking kinda ratty after getting all the masking tape off; so I just smeared it with extra resin.

And I can't have that!!! lol It's the only thing that's "original" in this whole thread - my design. Everything else is copied from somewhere; can't even say for sure that Seacast in the gusset is original? Mighta seen that somewhere? - seen so much since I started this, can't remember. My head's been buried in this transom for so long, I hadn't seen the bow until yesterday!! :facepalm: :lol::lol:

 

[sphelps]

Cardboard tubes were used quite often as stiffeners ... They glass them in under closed bow decks for added strength. And on hull bottoms ..

 

[jrttoday]

was not going to post cause this isn't finished, had a minor emergency pull me away. But this is what happens when I change direction in mid-stream. Small gap between sump box and wood because it was fit before the tubes were installed
http://

no big deal, just saying it's best to have it all figured out before you cut!! And I can't believe I didn't see the air in that seam in the box before today - it's the gouge directly above the drain hole. After routing the livewell fill, I had planned on it being raised off the deck. And will make a shallow trough in the opening on port side.
Both pieces are 1" slope from side to keel.
Managed to get six assorted jugs underneath for a net total of 553 fluid ozs. That's a bit more than 4 gallons of air. Put resin on the cap threads. Hopefully will never know if that was enough

If ever I replace the transom in my 12' aluminum, it will be towel tubes and glass!! :lol:

PS: photo was darkened on Microsoft Picture Manager, to see gap better

 

[sphelps]

Did you glass the bottom of the plywood before the install ?
Prolly would have given a bit more moister resistance just thinking ..

 

[jrttoday]

only painted with Killlz, there should never be any water in there, was only a teensy bit before and have most likely taken care of that. Plus Herculiner over deck this time. Good thing I pulled the Garboard plug to check one last time; despite my best efforts to keep resin out when installing livewell PVC, there was 1/2" of resin set up against the plug. Guess it drains OK :lol:
http://[URL=http://s173.photobucket.com/user/jrttoday/media/DSCF0004_zpsofvyoq67.jpg.html]

just from other side view last night; I can't safely get up on the boat for an overhead view - wires and cables etc etc. and I don't want to move 'em around just yet. Just saying, that's why my pics are limited in view. this is a little boat with big boat features. A lot's going on in a very small area, and it's rough on me to be bent over and stay that way for long periods of time - every day all day.
What I used to could do all day now takes me all day just to do :violin::lol:[/URL]

 

[jrttoday]

here's a tip!! notice how I'm holding that corner down? lol
http://[URL=http://s173.photobucket.com/user/jrttoday/media/DSCF0002_zpskornl8xk.jpg.html]

the plan was... I had bought a yard of "finish" woven and that's all they were gonna get. Should've stuck to 24 because I'm not used to the lightweight finish stuff. I'll share this cos "I" think it's funny!! Wet the wood out and laid the csm no problem. Seemed like I had to fight the woven because it's so light. Played with it forever to get it laying right - and finally!!! seemed to have it all so well, THEN!! A string popped loose and rather than cut it, I pulled on it....... and just about all of it came up before I could stop :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: Had played with it so long, it was starting to kick!!!! OMG!!

Got it all back down except for about 5" a quarter inch wide - sander took care of that.
Port side (under can) came out OK, but it'll get the same tomorrow? csm/24/csm, Probably need tab up further, especially on gunwales????
At the brush handle is the end of the trough; it's 13" long and will be +or- 1/4" deep. Nothing spectacular, just as easy to make as filling the void - probably never make any difference that I'll notice. Just something different[/URL]