First rebuild - '89 Campion Allante 185 - Stringers, Deck, Transom

[kcassells]

I did the transom but the smaller pieces are not treated at all, just glued together with Titebond.

Read the titebond instructions before you glass. It needs to gass off for a few days or the glass will bubble up. I just looked at the 5200 and it says 7 days. All depends on weather.

Check this out;

http://www.glen-l.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=15362

 

[steve_h7]

Read the titebond instructions before you glass. It needs to gass off for a few days or the glass will bubble up. I just looked at the 5200 and it says 7 days. All depends on weather.

Check this out;

http://www.glen-l.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=15362

Good thread, thanks for that. I didn't get to read the whole thing but will tonight. I also didn't get a chance to cover those pieces today so that might have coincidentally worked in my favor. Cut snow damaged trees all day and I'm worn out.

 

[steve_h7]

Some thoughts and questions post using CSM for the first time...
In all honesty, when I attempted to cover the smaller supplemental pieces above the transom with chopped strand, I was pretty sure Satan himself had probably invented CSM. I underestimated the importance of rounding the 90* edges and corners and consequently I had air bubbles everywhere. It was a disaster and I was very frustrated. So I ground it all off and after watching Andy at Boat Works Today's video of how to apply CSM on plywood for about the 20th time I tried again after grinding the edges of the plywood to make them all rounded. It worked much better but I could see it was still clearly an art form and I now have a new level of admiration for him and all of you that have mastered it. :thumb:

So my initial question after wrapping the small pieces in CSM, is that is there something people use on the fin rollers that prevents it from sticking to the CSM and pulling it off the plywood when trying to use them to eliminate air bubbles? It seemed like every time I tried it, it only made things worse. Any other helpful tips? It seemed like every time I even looked at it I had attracted clumps of fibers on my gloves. :facepalm:

So despite the learning curve with CSM, I now have a layer of 1708 over the whole transom itself, and then I put a layer of CSM over it on the transom and extended it over the smaller pieces in the upper right and left corners. It seems very solid but do I need more? I'm looking forward to start working on the stringers.

 

[dezmond]

Nice work Steve. CSM is a bugger to work with for sure! I used to use it all the time building spinners for small aircraft. I HATED it for that reason of it sticking on your gloves all the time. A bit of baby powder helped. So did keeping your gloves dry from resin. It is hard. I just made sure we had a couple boxes of gloves and changed them frequently to keep them dry. Bubble blasters work good. Some times you get too much resin on them and that can cause the build up. Keep some acetone near by and when not using throw it in the jar. This will help some. As for how much glass do you need, I can't say for sure but someone will jump in and let you know. Did you measure thickness before you ripped it out? Poly was in there so you could build it back to what was there.

 

[Mechanicalmike08]

Like Dez said keep the roller clean, I kept a qt metal can full of acetone around all the time so I could just set my stuff in when not using it. I actually ended up using my hands a bit for up and overs. The other big this is if you can tear up a little bit the area that the bend will be, fold it a few times back and forth and get it to break up a little bit to break the tension.

 

[steve_h7]

Good tips, thank you both. I wasn't sure what direct effect acetone would have on the resin itself so I was hesitant to use the roller right after dipping it, but I certainly did notice it no longer pulled the fibers up after coating it in acetone. I'll be a little more liberal in the future. :thumb:

 

[kcassells]

I would suggest minimal 2 1708 layers.

 

[steve_h7]

Okay... so I cut my 1708 about 3" from the edge and the CSM 1" from the edge; would you go back to 3" short so as not to put edge on top of edge or should it be shorter?

 

[kcassells]

Not sure how I read your description Steve. I always roll my glass over the corner/past @ 3" and next pc. over that by 2"more. The last overlaps the prior. Tops, sides and bottoms. That just how I do it.

 

[steve_h7]

Sorry, another question...
I wish I had paid more attention when gutting the boat to how the floor was arranged, but glad at least I took pictures and only wish I had taken more. But I wanted to get another opinion if I'm putting the boat back together the way it was. Here are a few pictures; before deconstruction and through the process. Looking at the last one and how the pattern is cut into the gelcoat, it looks like the foam filled seat frames were tabbed to the transom and the actual boat floor stops at the beginning of the boxes, is that right? Maybe it's more common than I thought but I couldn't remember any other rebuilds that were sort of suspended off the hull with tabbing and the foam looks to be providing the support?

 

[kcassells]

Kinda a Crapo design to me. I would install the deck, allow for foam. Then build the seat if that's what you want. Then foam in that box of the seat. . It become a separate component.You are at a point where you can modify the plan if you think it out. Sitting next to an outboard blows. Just saying.

 

[steve_h7]

Thanks and that's what I had planned on trying to do but as I map out my stringer heights to achieve the old deck height, in the rear portion where those seats are I'm finding the deck height would hit the side walls and be too high to to rest on the bottom of the hull. Maybe the best option would be to drop the deck height to a point where I can make that happen and then work forward and do like you suggested and make the floor and the boxes two separate pieces. If I do that I guess I better put the tank back in to be sure I'm still maintaining enough height to clear it too.

 

[kcassells]

Yea, the tank needs to make it's clearances with fittings attached. Looks like you should be able to run stringers to the transom. Kinda can't tell 100% by the pics.
Stand back and take some other pics. Old and new. Take millions of pics cause the start and the anticpated end are always 2 different things. I'm on 5 yrs. pics, pics, pics...questions, questions and research the crap out your boat for other builds over the internet.
Anyone else want to chime in?

 

[Chris51280]

I'm with Kevin there. It's easier to make the deck then foam. then build the additional box with foam on top. It is probably measured out how much foam your boat needed and this is additional space for foam to keep yours afloat

 

[steve_h7]

Thanks guys... okay, I'm limited obviously on "before" pictures but I'll post some more and see if I hit on a view that will help. I put the tank in and stuck the small support that was cut out from under it and it looks like I should have about inch and a half clearance over the lowest point of tank. I don't know if that's enough or not but I took some pictures of it in place along with a board as to where the underside of the deck would be. The tank fittings are under the splash well in an open area where the hull and bilge are exposed, so they shouldn't be an issue. I'll draw in on one of the pictures where the stringers will sit. They look like they should still be a perfect fit on each side of the tank. The tank didn't have any rubber support strips I've seen some use when I took it out, but there should be room enough to add some if they're needed.

 

[kcassells]

You need to take into account the fill and vent fittings. I don't see them in this pic.

 

[steve_h7]

You need to take into account the fill and vent fittings. I don't see them in this pic.

This is difficult to explain how it is set up and makes it harder because I never took any good pics during the tear down... but the filler hose attachment, vents, and fuel sensor actually sit in an open area under the splash well, so they won't be in the way no matter how low I need to bring the deck. There is no plywood decking under the splash well between the stringers. I'll post the best picture I have of under the splash well during the deconstruction but I know it doesn't show it very well. I'll also post another pic of the tank in the cleaned hull and the fill and vent attachments are just on the back side of the level in the picture.
I think I can set the deck like you and Chris have said would be best if that inch or two is enough to clear gas tank. The original deck was 1/2" but I could up that if I had to to avoid flexing... but from what I've read after adding CSM on the underside and another on top along with tabbing, even 1/2" ACX is pretty solid.

 

[sopwithcamel74]

Same layout as my Capri. My plan is to extend the decking below the jump seats to the transom, leaving a 'v' if you will in the area beneath the splash well for bilge access.

Yours is the same as mine - peeking into the bilge you have full access to the tank fittings and the sending unit. From what I observe, there is zero reason to stop the deck at the fore edge of the jump seats. Not sure why so many builders from the era did it that way, other than possibly a minuscule cost savings on materials.

The inner stringers should seal those outer chambers from your bilge and tank compartment; foam the crap out of everything like the others have said and you're golden.

 

[steve_h7]

Perfect, thank you for the feedback! And your Capri does indeed sound exactly the same as mine. I'm off to catch up with your build. :joyous:

 

[ACon977]

Chiming in a little late, but regarding your roller and pulling up the fibers.

Make sure that you are taking the roller off the handle after you are done for the day and rinse it all out with Acetone, the main reason I found it pulling fibers was when the roller was getting seized up due to junk in that area.

Also, use a chip brush to "paint" a first batch of resin onto your surface, then put down your CSM or 1708 on top, using your hands to get it into the right position and let the resin start to soak through from the bottom, then mix up the second batch of resin you finish with. I just dunked my roller into my resin and then rolled it out onto the glass, working in single strips down the piece, letting the binder break down. then once I had done a 3-4 ft section, would go back to where I started and actually roll it out to get rid of the bubbles and finalize where you want to push the resin around. Its definitely the fastest way, and you do need to let the resin break down the binder between the fibers so that its easier to work with.

Enjoying watching your progress!