Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

[Thalasso]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

If that is the case, why would anyone want a 4 stroke? My 2.6L, #600 2 stroke, will run circles around 4 strokes twice it's size.

Eventually you won't be able to buy a 2 stroke. Most if not all of the OB companies are slowly switching over to 4 stroke. That OB is going to look funny with a catalytic convertor hanging off of it.:lol::lol:

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

Where are you getting those weights from? Even the 460 in my streetrod doesn't weigh 1000lbs.

That's engine, transom assembly, and outdrive.

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

gtochris, I have the same fear as you. They are "choking" a 5.7 down to 225hp. Doesn't sound like a good idea to me.

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

gtochris, I have the same fear as you. They are "choking" a 5.7 down to 225hp. Doesn't sound like a good idea to me.

That can be said about any engine that isn't pushed to it's HP limits, lol. The old Merc 260 5.7L (probably 220-230 shaft HP) wasn't considered to be "choked down", so why would this?! Is it putting out the 300HP of the 350 MAG?! No, but it's not like they are taking the 1970's approach and strapping a 2bbl carb on a big block and severely retarding the timing. Which is better, a 4.3L making 225HP, or a 5.7L making 225HP? The 5.7L is doing the same work with more torque and at a lower load to the engine.

 

[gtochris]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

gtochris, I have the same fear as you. They are "choking" a 5.7 down to 225hp. Doesn't sound like a good idea to me.

The cited MPG numbers are pretty good, on par or better it seems as the 4.3L from some of the articles I have read, but now that Cats are on boats it seems to be a game changer.

I'm generally a Mercruiser guy since that is what is around here and all I have owned.

 

[H20Rat]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

Eventually you won't be able to buy a 2 stroke. Most if not all of the OB companies are slowly switching over to 4 stroke. That OB is going to look funny with a catalytic convertor hanging off of it.:lol::lol:

Right now the outboards with the best emissions are 2 strokes! There is nothing to prevent a catalytic converter from being put onto an outboard either, just some reworking of the bottom of the engine, IF they are ever required. 2 strokes with a cat are still physically smaller than a similar 4 without one!

Two Stroke Engines - Examining Today's Outboard Engines

 

[Slip Away]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

yes

Volvo Penta unveils new technology at event in Sweden 26 June 2013: GOTHENBURG, Sweden ? Nearly 50 journalists from 14 countries gathered last week at the Volvo Penta test center, Krossholmen, in Gothenburg, Sweden, for the introduction of new engines and piloting systems.
"This event marks the next phase of integration of new technologies to make boating easier," vice president of product management Johan Wasterang

 

[agallant80]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

I have to admit that I think Volvo has way better future vision and technology then Mercruiser. Recent Volvo inniovations have been

1. Manifolds that last the life of the motor
2. Using a V8 instead of a V6 same HP, more torque, better balance etc
3. Water sensors for the bellows and drive oil that alert you if water is detected

Those are some huge things. Mercruiser has some catching up to do but they won't care. If you want a searay, baliner, or any of the other brands Brunswick owns then you will only be able to get a Mercruiser power package in them. That is why Volvo has to inniovate and Merc can sit on their butt and still sell motors and outdrives.

 

[Thalasso]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

Right now the outboards with the best emissions are 2 strokes! There is nothing to prevent a catalytic converter from being put onto an outboard either, just some reworking of the bottom of the engine, IF they are ever required. 2 strokes with a cat are still physically smaller than a similar 4 without one!

Two Stroke Engines - Examining Today's Outboard Engines

Yep. Those Evinrudes are supposed to be the most efficient.

 

[Thalasso]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

Eventually Merc will catch up.

An example of easy-to-use product recently introduced is Volvo Penta’s Joystick Driving technology (introduced last year) that allows the skipper to use the joystick at high speeds. “You don’t have to have a steering wheel,” Kull said at a Volvo Penta press outing last fall. “The whole idea is to incorporate the joystick into the arm of the helm seat to allow the operator to sit back in comfort. It’s ideal for long-distance boating and works with the autopilot

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

Eventually Merc will catch up.

An example of easy-to-use product recently introduced is Volvo Penta’s Joystick Driving technology (introduced last year) that allows the skipper to use the joystick at high speeds.

I'm not positive, but I thought Merc was the first one who brought the joystick technology to the pleasure-boating world? I know that the Zeus and Axiom systems had them back in '07 or so, but I don't know if they are limited to low-speed use. The Volvo IPS drives also use a joystick, but I thought Merc was the first to bring it to market.

 

[Slip Away]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

I'm not positive, but I thought Merc was the first one who brought the joystick technology to the pleasure-boating world? I know that the Zeus and Axiom systems had them back in '07 or so, but I don't know if they are limited to low-speed use. The Volvo IPS drives also use a joystick, but I thought Merc was the first to bring it to market.

Volvo introduced IPS with joystick control first. Merc/Cummins rushed to get Zeus pod drives into production after that. Neither Zeus or IPS allows control of the boat at higher than docking speeds, until last year with Volvo's new control. You still can't control (drive) a boat with Zeus or Axius joystick at any speed over idle.

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

That can be said about any engine that isn't pushed to it's HP limits, lol. The old Merc 260 5.7L (probably 220-230 shaft HP) wasn't considered to be "choked down", so why would this?! Is it putting out the 300HP of the 350 MAG?! No, but it's not like they are taking the 1970's approach and strapping a 2bbl carb on a big block and severely retarding the timing. Which is better, a 4.3L making 225HP, or a 5.7L making 225HP? The 5.7L is doing the same work with more torque and at a lower load to the engine.

While I agree with most of what you're saying, especially the retarded timing and little carbs, there are other ways to "choke" an engine. Restrictive exhaust is one (check) and lower lift cams (I don't know the specs). Both contribute to a big motor that can feel like a "dog".

Your old 260 wasn't choked, because that was about all it could produce. But when Vortec heads were introduced it really WOKE up the SBC. In pickups, they went from 210hp and 300lb-ft of torque to 255hp and 330lb-ft of torque! That's a big jump in power. I hate to see them give it up.

However, with better engine controls, maybe their improved fuel economy numbers will come to fruition in the real world? I sure hope so.

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

Your old 260 wasn't choked, because that was about all it could produce. But when Vortec heads were introduced it really WOKE up the SBC. In pickups, they went from 210hp and 300lb-ft of torque to 255hp and 330lb-ft of torque! That's a big jump in power. I hate to see them give it up.

True, but remember that it's only one variant of the 5.7L, and users likely won't be able to tell the difference in performance over a 4.3L, so no one is the wiser. They will still have the 250-300HP variants which "wake up" the motor and give the regular performance. The only caveat I have is why you would opt for the 225HP version when you could get another 50-75HP for what amounts to a miniscule difference in parts?!

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

... The only caveat I have is why you would opt for the 225HP version when you could get another 50-75HP for what amounts to a miniscule difference in parts?!

Because VP will upcharge something like $5000 for that 50hp!

 

[gtochris]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

True, but remember that it's only one variant of the 5.7L, and users likely won't be able to tell the difference in performance over a 4.3L, so no one is the wiser. They will still have the 250-300HP variants which "wake up" the motor and give the regular performance. The only caveat I have is why you would opt for the 225HP version when you could get another 50-75HP for what amounts to a miniscule difference in parts?!

I think the enhanced torque of the 5.7L will be very evident, especially to skiing/ boarding. I sure hope VP is on par with the fuel economy benefits. Interesting they chose the 5.7L block rather the 5.0 which I think is testomony to wanting the torque/ engine can run on lower RPM's?

I wish this were like buying cars where they were easily accessible and test drives sealed the deal in terms of expectations vs real world performance.

I wouldnt be surprised with the cost of adapting Cats and other EPA related technology if in the future there are only one or two engine choices. (Economics at large), Sorta how cars evolved over the last 40 years where now you only have one or two choices.

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

I wouldnt be surprised with the cost of adapting Cats and other EPA related technology if in the future there are only one or two engine choices. (Economics at large), Sorta how cars evolved over the last 40 years where now you only have one or two choices.

I dunno, my 2008 truck had 3 or 4 engine options, most cars seem have 2-3 engine options. Most boats include the same. A 20ft runabout usually has a V6, a 5.0L, and a 5.7L option. You get the base engine, a mid-level engine, and a high output engine option. I don't expect it will change too much simply because the mfg has to meet certain price points and will want each product line to appeal to as broad a range of customers as possible. I mean, a 1968 Corvette only had two "engine options" (327 or 427), but 2 or 3 horsepower ratings for each engine. That's sort of how Volvo has it setup, where the 5.7L will have a 225HP, a 270HP, and a 300HP version all out of the same block/engine.

 

[H20Rat]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

I wouldnt be surprised with the cost of adapting Cats and other EPA related technology if in the future there are only one or two engine choices. (Economics at large), Sorta how cars evolved over the last 40 years where now you only have one or two choices.

I see haulnazz beat me to it, but there are MORE choices now in the automotive field. There is minimal reuse of engine blocks between different bodies, and almost no cross-manufacturer engine sharing. Almost every vehicle platform has at least 3 or 4 choices, and those are specific to that platform. Adding a cat and electronic controls to an engine is actually relatively trivial, as well as removing said cat(s).

I know the marine environment held out on electronic engine controls (and EFI) for a LONG time, some of that was based on electronics vs water, but it was mostly because of the manufacturers wanting to maintain status quo. There was no reason to advance when you had such a limited number of engine/drive mfgs. Once you start adding things like direct fuel injection to gasoline engines, you can end up with some very nice gas power plants! (direct air injection is starting to be looked at for gas engines also, which is borrowing lots of diesel tech.)

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

Where are you getting those weights from? Even the 460 in my streetrod doesn't weigh 1000lbs.

It would if it had cast iron water cooled headers and the other marine stuff attached to it (like a stern drive).

 

[robopath]

Re: Has anyone noticed the new VP 225 V8 engine? Is this the future?

Because VP will upcharge something like $5000 for that 50hp!

Actually it's about $1200 to go from the V8 225 to the V8 270 , at least on a new Four Winns. I chose the non-cat V6 225 because I could still get one. It was an additional $2600 for the V8 225 and $4,000 for the 270.