LiFePO Batteries ???

airshot

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Thank's for posting all this good LifePO4 battery info.....mine is on its way, getting all my information ready to go when it arrives.
 

airshot

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Ok....have my new 140ah battery, charger and ready to go. Trying to think ahead to be ready when the season opens up here in the next month or two. There might be periods of time that I can't use my boat, weather, life etc....and these new smart batteries don't like being stored at a full charge. All recommendations come down to a 50-60% charge for storage. All the info I have uncovered so far has said to attach a " device" to draw the battery down, so....what " devices" are folks using ? Looking around I am finding a small blower/ heater used in cars and trucks that run on 12v. Thinking one if these might be the ticket to draw down my battery to storage capacity. Any other suggestion or recommendations from those that have been there and done that ?? Thanks in advance,........
 

tpenfield

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My understanding is that the recommendation to store at mid-level charge (50-60%) is more for long term storage. Not sure if not using the boat for a few weeks or more is really going to break anything.

I'd just see how things go . . . maybe run your blowers while you are closing up the boat to draw the batteries down a bit. If the battery is sitting at around 13.2 volts, it is probably fine.

I have a set-up where the solar charging brings the batteries up during the day and the parasitic loads draw things down a bit at night. Overall the batteries stay at well above 50% capacity during boating season.

My problem seems to be more over the winter is that the charging to the battery shuts off (via LTCP) as the temperature gets to 32˚F, but the parasitic drains continue until around 4˚F (IIRC), thus draining the battery to a low voltage shut off point.

I'm concerned if you have something to drain the battery down it might be too much, or require some sophisticated regulation process (timer). :unsure:
 

airshot

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My understanding is that the recommendation to store at mid-level charge (50-60%) is more for long term storage. Not sure if not using the boat for a few weeks or more is really going to break anything.

I'd just see how things go . . . maybe run your blowers while you are closing up the boat to draw the batteries down a bit. If the battery is sitting at around 13.2 volts, it is probably fine.

I have a set-up where the solar charging brings the batteries up during the day and the parasitic loads draw things down a bit at night. Overall the batteries stay at well above 50% capacity during boating season.

My problem seems to be more over the winter is that the charging to the battery shuts off (via LTCP) as the temperature gets to 32˚F, but the parasitic drains continue until around 4˚F (IIRC), thus draining the battery to a low voltage shut off point.

I'm concerned if you have something to drain the battery down it might be too much, or require some sophisticated regulation process (timer). :unsure:
Have similar thoughts, but want to do what is best for the battery. My boat is trailered and stores in my barn. LifePo4 battery is only for my trolling motor, nothing else. There are periods of time maby a month or so where the fishing slows down and more joy riding takes place where the electric motor is not used. Lots of articles on keeping the battery at a storage charge when not using for a period of time. No mfgr has actually stated how long that period of time is ! Folks often mention putting a load on the battery to drop it down to a storage charge, but no one mentions what they use as a load to drop the charge. Battery does have a fancy built in battery monitor that sends info to my phone, so monitoring it is not a big problem.
 

bruceb58

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I use LiFePO4 batteries in my travel trailer. I store them at between 50% to 70% when they won't be used for a month. If you are using the boat everyday, just keep them at 100%.
 

bruceb58

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Anyone have experiences with Battle Born battles? Been thinking of switching my batteries over but trying to justify the prices and they are even high on Amazon haha

Battle Born Batteries
I used to have a couple when LiFePO4 batteries were relatively new to market. They are great batteries but not really worth the price premium these days. Many other good options.
 

airshot

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I use LiFePO4 batteries in my travel trailer. I store them at between 50% to 70% when they won't be used for a month. If you are using the boat everyday, just keep them at 100%.
Using the boat everyday is a dream we all have...lol...at best a couple times a week is more accurate. There have been periods of time when it sits for weeks and that is my concern. There are days when you go out with a fully charged batter but due to conditions it doesn't get used then might sit for weeks before getting out again. Just looking for a way to drop the charge down while it sits for a period of time and wondered what others use.
 

bruceb58

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Using the boat everyday is a dream we all have...lol...at best a couple times a week is more accurate. There have been periods of time when it sits for weeks and that is my concern. There are days when you go out with a fully charged batter but due to conditions it doesn't get used then might sit for weeks before getting out again. Just looking for a way to drop the charge down while it sits for a period of time and wondered what others use.
For weeks I would not be concerned. Just don't charge them up right away until you are going to use it again. Typically, the only thing that would happen is that you might only get 2000 charge cycles vs 3000 charge cycles...probably more than you would do in your lifetime anyway.
 

tpenfield

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Quick Update . . .

My automatic charger (really an automotive battery charger) did not work to wake-up the batteries, as I suspected.

I reached out to my good friends at LiTime and they agreed with my synopsis about the batteries having reached the low SoC limit over the winter. They suggested I use a charger with 'lithium activation' function, which I will get & try.
 

cyclops222

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If you HAVE TO discharge the battery to 50 or 60 % of capacity ?
You have a generic Lithium Battery chemistry.
It is NOT a true LIFEPO4 chemistry battery.
I have true A123 Brand of LIFEPO4 batteries. I harvested Black and Decker power tool packs. Some have been stored at 100 % of full capacity 10 years ago. They still have 90% of capacity in them. I have run the TRUE A123 packs down to15 %. They recharge up to 90 % every time. They are in a small B & D stick floor vacuum cleaner.
NO company has to tell the truth about what chemistry they are building with. They can lie just to sell more expensive batteries.
 

bruceb58

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If you HAVE TO discharge the battery to 50 or 60 % of capacity ?
You have a generic Lithium Battery chemistry.
It is NOT a true LIFEPO4 chemistry battery.
I have true A123 Brand of LIFEPO4 batteries. I harvested Black and Decker power tool packs. Some have been stored at 100 % of full capacity 10 years ago. They still have 90% of capacity in them. I have run the TRUE A123 packs down to15 %. They recharge up to 90 % every time. They are in a small B & D stick floor vacuum cleaner.
NO company has to tell the truth about what chemistry they are building with. They can lie just to sell more expensive batteries.
All these batteries are LiFePO4. If they were a different chemistry, the voltage would be WAY different and would not work where a substitute for a 12V battery is used.

Not sure where you heard that the batteries have to be discharged to 50% or 60% of capacity. That's just a recommended storage for almost all lithium batteries so that you maximize the potential number of cycles of the battery.
 

bruceb58

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Quick Update . . .

My automatic charger (really an automotive battery charger) did not work to wake-up the batteries, as I suspected.

I reached out to my good friends at LiTime and they agreed with my synopsis about the batteries having reached the low SoC limit over the winter. They suggested I use a charger with 'lithium activation' function, which I will get & try.
I have a Victron IP65 charger that has a power supply mode that would be perfect.

Also. all you really have to do is get a regular lead acid battery and some jumper cables and you can do the same thing. Just be aware that once the batteries wake up, the amount of current may be high so be prepared to remove the cables fast.
 

airshot

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If you HAVE TO discharge the battery to 50 or 60 % of capacity ?
You have a generic Lithium Battery chemistry.
It is NOT a true LIFEPO4 chemistry battery.
I have true A123 Brand of LIFEPO4 batteries. I harvested Black and Decker power tool packs. Some have been stored at 100 % of full capacity 10 years ago. They still have 90% of capacity in them. I have run the TRUE A123 packs down to15 %. They recharge up to 90 % every time. They are in a small B & D stick floor vacuum cleaner.
NO company has to tell the truth about what chemistry they are building with. They can lie just to sell more expensive batteries.
Been around lipo batteries for well over 15 years and all function far better when dropped down to a storage level of charge. Those that have been stored at near full charge have had much shorter life spans or decreased run times. No big deal to discharge them to storage charge. With my Timeusb, it tells you how long it takes to drop down to whatever you want.
Just set the timer and done, might as well take care of them so they last.
 

airshot

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All these batteries are LiFePO4. If they were a different chemistry, the voltage would be WAY different and would not work where a substitute for a 12V battery is used.

Not sure where you heard that the batteries have to be discharged to 50% or 60% of capacity. That's just a recommended storage for almost all lithium batteries so that you maximize the potential number of cycles of the battery.
Not a " have to" just the mfg recommendation for max life.. Easy enough to do, so why not ?
 

bruceb58

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Not a " have to" just the mfg recommendation for max life.. Easy enough to do, so why not ?
I do store mine at that level but if you don't, might get 2,000 cycles instead of 3,000 cycles.

On the Rivian, in the lower range models that use LiFePO4, Rivian suggests keeping them at 100% so they don't get out of balance.

You have a manual form Timeusb that shows they recommend a certain storage level? I have heard various issues with Timeusb BMS not allowing you to get full advertised current output. Wonder if they have started putting in a better BMS. They also have a recommended charge current of only 20A for a 100AH battery...that's lame.
 
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cyclops222

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Many people are NOT using A123 Chemistry batteries. All LIFEPO4 batteries are not going to be A123 chemistry batteries.
A123 is a patented chemical process that only the company of A123 can make and sell. A123 can be stored for years at 100 % of capacity with a full lifespan. I will go to www.a123.com And see what they say now.
My age is showing again. The company is now fully Chinese owned and called A123 systems. Oh well.
 
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bruceb58

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LOL...A123 batteries are still LiFePO4 battery cells and they are the EXACT same chemistry as all LiFePO4 batteries!
 

tpenfield

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Also. all you really have to do is get a regular lead acid battery and some jumper cables and you can do the same thing. Just be aware that once the batteries wake up, the amount of current may be high so be prepared to remove the cables fast.
I was thinking about doing the jumper cable thing, but concerned about the amount of current that the LFP batteries would soak up.

Also, the folks at LiTime recommended their 20 amp charger w/ activation feature. I'll probably buy one from them, because they were so nice. :D
(y)
 
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