new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

[JimS123]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

The people in china are smarter then you give them credit for.Were do you think all the fireworks in the world come from,china.So not everything they make is junk.

Hahahaha. Since China invented gunpowder 12 centuries ago I surely would hope they know how to make it right. You're right, not everything they make is junk, just the things they copy.

I spent the last year working with and supervising a Chinese crew and I can attest that they are very intelligent people. Plus, they are hard working, company loyal, country loyal and they live for their jobs. I got to know many of them very well and it saddened me to know that it took them 25 days to earn what I did in an hour! They were all very nice people and I liked them alot.

The SS parts they supplied were magnetic; the rotating mechanisms were spot welded, not continuous; the electricals didn't meet UL requirements; the support structure didn't pass the US structural engineer's inspection. Some of the stuff didn't work, the rest broke. They have a web site that attests to the reliability of their equipment. They have installations in 8 countries worldwide.

Its not a matter of intelligence. Maybe they are smarter than we are. Use substandard materials and construction, then employ intelligent workers that happily do their jobs for pennies. Then, you can beat all the competition in price and still sell all you can make. Very astute business model.

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

Hahahaha. Since China invented gunpowder 12 centuries ago I surely would hope they know how to make it right. You're right, not everything they make is junk, just the things they copy.

I spent the last year working with and supervising a Chinese crew and I can attest that they are very intelligent people. Plus, they are hard working, company loyal, country loyal and they live for their jobs. I got to know many of them very well and it saddened me to know that it took them 25 days to earn what I did in an hour! They were all very nice people and I liked them alot.

The SS parts they supplied were magnetic; the rotating mechanisms were spot welded, not continuous; the electricals didn't meet UL requirements; the support structure didn't pass the US structural engineer's inspection. Some of the stuff didn't work, the rest broke. They have a web site that attests to the reliability of their equipment. They have installations in 8 countries worldwide.

Its not a matter of intelligence. Maybe they are smarter than we are. Use substandard materials and construction, then employ intelligent workers that happily do their jobs for pennies. Then, you can beat all the competition in price and still sell all you can make. Very astute business model.

And they also eat dogs

 

[64osby]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

My wife and I try and but American whenever we can, it is getting harder everday. Across the street from my office, there was an apple orchard for over 50 years. The guy sold it to a developer because the Chinese imported apples where selling for less than he could harvest and get his to market for, he could not make any money.

I recently watched a show where a guy in California is converting cars to electric vehicles, (he used Toyota's). When asked about who will be supplying the Lithium Ion batteries, he stated they will be Chinese made because the Chinese (Govt) committed to building a plant to be production ready within 6 months time. He stated the earliest time frame in the US was 3 years due to regulations. He also stated the Chinese put all the $ into the plant up front, where US prospects were asking him to invest $ in the plant.

There are few examples of good long term quality products coming from China, IMHO. The US products that are successful when manufacturing in China spend a huge amount of time and money on QC. I have know 3 people that have been operations managers over there. They spent 2-3 years getting up and running and maintaining it. Right after they left, the product quality decreased. I know two of those plants have been pulled back to the US because the poor quality cost the company more in the long run.

I do hope the pendulum will swing back towards the US producing more products, and people demanding to buy US products, because if it doesn't, we at some point will become fully dependent on foriegn products. When that happens our country will stay in a contant state of recession / depression. Then we will never pay back the trillions of $ the Chinese have loaned us.

 

[JimS123]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

And they also eat dogs

Well, that's not quite true, but here's a godshonest true story that fits right in with the discussion...

About 25 years ago I replied to an ad for an old aluminum fishing boat. The guy said to come to his restaurant and he'd show it to me. A Chinese Restaurant, he was Chinese and the place was crammed to the door. He said too busy, but gave me the keys to the garage at his house and said go and take a look yourself. Only 3 blocks away.

The boat was crap, but that's another story. So I locked the garage back up and started to leave to take the keys back. This was a city lot but had a 8' privacy fence, with 3 sides of the backyard lined with small 12"x12" SS "lockers" (for lack of a better word), stacked 8 high. Each one had a 1" screened opening in the center of the door. My curiosity got the best of me so I looked into a dozen or so openings to inspect what was inside. Each one meowed back at me when I looked in!

 

[boater1234]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

Well you guys just made me think of something.Some people say that most of the stuff is disposable or not built well,that may be true for their outboards or some other things they do.Just for the heck of it i went and looked at all the rc cars and trucks i have + my lipo and nimh batteries +chargers are all made in china.I have over 12 cars and trucks and do some moderate racing[brushless electric]and they have never failed me once unless i broke something on them.Not that it is the same as an outboard but it is china built.Never had a battery explode,never had a motor fail once yet,all my chargers,batteries,controllers,and over half of my trucks say made in china and i have had them for many yrs with good service.The other half is made in taiwan.Like i said the verdict is out on them.They are slowly coming to the united states so don't be suprised to see one at a local dealer in the future.Who knows they may just hold together and give people something to look foward to.Then again they may just fall apart and be junk.I have read that they have been in business for over 3yrs and have sold over 50,00 units anually around the world.All my thing is if they were very good outboards i don't think anyone would hesitate to buy a 15hp 4stroke for $1700 as that is dirt cheap.Hopefully they turn out good.

 

[boater1234]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

meow,it all tastes like chicken.

 

[Howard Sterndrive]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

$1700 might be a good price... But,,, what are you going to do in 2, 5, 10 years when you need a part for it?

2 years shouldn't be an issue as it has a 30 month warranty

5 or 10 - maybe toss it... it's a gamble, but also a gamble on American companies staying in business

 

[fishrdan]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

also a gamble on American companies staying in business

LOL, you got me on that one!

If all the US companies start having their products made in China, why not just buy a "Chinese" product. Cut out the middle man. It could be a vicious cycle though....

- US companies cut out US workers and have everything made in China
- US workers cut out US companies and start buying everything from Chinese companies
- US companies go out of business and Chinese companies set up shop in the US
- English becomes a second language in the US, Chinese becomes the official language
- US President #49 is Chan Hwoung

:facepalm:

 

[JBF 1962]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

AAAAHHHHHHHHHHHG!!!! so danged confusing! But, I'd still rather have a used Evinrude...

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

Well, that's not quite true, but here's a godshonest true story that fits right in with the discussion...

About 25 years ago I replied to an ad for an old aluminum fishing boat. The guy said to come to his restaurant and he'd show it to me. A Chinese Restaurant, he was Chinese and the place was crammed to the door. He said too busy, but gave me the keys to the garage at his house and said go and take a look yourself. Only 3 blocks away.

The boat was crap, but that's another story. So I locked the garage back up and started to leave to take the keys back. This was a city lot but had a 8' privacy fence, with 3 sides of the backyard lined with small 12"x12" SS "lockers" (for lack of a better word), stacked 8 high. Each one had a 1" screened opening in the center of the door. My curiosity got the best of me so I looked into a dozen or so openings to inspect what was inside. Each one meowed back at me when I looked in!

The Chinese and Koreans both eat dog...Not all of them of course, but it is on the menu in some areas I've never tried dog myself, but the day isn't over yet and the Rottweiler next door IS getting on my nerves

 

[JimS123]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

The Chinese and Koreans both eat dog...Not all of them of course, but it is on the menu in some areas I've never tried dog myself, but the day isn't over yet and the Rottweiler next door IS getting on my nerves

Oh I agree. I wasn't debating your statement - just pointing out that they sell pussycat as well...........to unsuspecting Americans.

They can eat whatever they want - they just can't SELL it in America, as its against the law!

Some of the restaurants in my city have been closed down because of cat bones in the garbage. Last year one was closed because they were selling illegal venison. Not that that's all that bad in itself. The real issue was that it was aged roadkill! (the story made headline news.....LOL)

 

[SparkieBoat]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

it is a chinese ploy to poison our food supply with road kill and cat meat...it is back firing..they didnt count on the rock gut American stomach. But I was in the HVAC business a while back and I can tell you defiantly stay away from any of the chinese HVAC equipment like Hier. worst junk ever made and the warranty is not honored. everything should be made in Japan.

 

[boater1234]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

Well i don't know if this changes anyones thinking but i went in to the marina were they have these hidea outboards.I know the guy for many yrs[10]I asked him if he would let the 15hp go for $1600 and to my suprise he said yes,the reason being is he has a whole other shipment coming in a few weeks.Like i said this is getting more interesting by the day.Wow brand new 15hp 4stroke with a 30mth warranty,hmmmmm.He has one 4hp,one 15hp,and one 9.9 left out of 20 motors he ordered around a yr ago.They are selling very slowly.He has not had one come back yet unless it was for like changing the lower unit oil or simple stuff,but no problems what so ever.I'm still thinking this over but it's peaking my interest more and more.

The thing that scares me the most is i have no experience with what type of power differece there will be between my little 72lb 15hp 2stroke merc and a 108lb 4stroke.What will be the difference in getting out of the hole?I think top end will be similar as a 15hp only makes 15hp.The motor is 323cc's,108lbs,2.08 gear ratio and a 30mth warranty.This motor will be going on a 14ft 230lb ncs alumacraft.What is really nice about the boat also it is front heavy because it has a nice 4ft wide deck on it so most of the weight is in the front of the boat.It will be good especially that this motor weighs alot more then the 2stroke.

So i really want to hear some serious opinions on this,should i just keep the 15hp 2stroke merc or sell it and go with the new brand of motor?Also i need people to really tell me what the power or torque difference will be in the 2 motors.That is my main concern.I'm not really scared of the brand as someone might as well try a new brand,who knows the risk may result in a reward.The merc i have is brand new also,as it has only been started 4times since it has been taken out of the box.Ok can't wait for some feedback on this.

 

[JimS123]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

Wow, it sounds like you're just anxious to get something new, whether you need it or not. Or, you have a lot of money burning a hole in your pocket. So follow my logical thinking and then decide for yourself........:

You already have a new 15 Merc. Why would you think the 15 hideous would be a better trade? Its the same HP. Why would you trade a known good Merc for an unknown unless you perceived a huge increase in performance?

You have been debating the Tohatpoo / E-Tec 25 HP dilemma for a week now. Obviously, you think that 15 HP isn't enough, so you want to go to 25 HP. So, how would the hideous 15 HP beat a 25 HP of any brand?

 

[boater1234]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

If you read the the other post jim i said i was just going to stay with the 15 for now.I have been back and forth and no i don't have alot of money to burn.I can simply sell the merc and get the 4stroke for nothing.I have been convinced enough that the 15 will be more then enough power for this boat.I have never owned a 4stroke before and i hear such good things about them.Sometimes change is good.I have had 2strokes all my life and they have served me well.It won't be long that you won't be able to get a 2stroke ever again unless it's used.I belive soon you may not be able to use anything on the water besides 3 star epa motors so we can [so we call it]go green and save the planet.Give it some time and all the states will be like california,not that it's a bad thing.I do alot of trolling and alot of idleing in my fishing so i have been thinking a 4stroke is set up for that type of fishing compared to a 2stroke.If you really want to get down to it i really would like to get a 20hp tohatsu 4stroke for this boat but it is a little pricey for me at the moment.I am just entertaining the idea of getting this motor because of how inexpensive it is which by the way does not make it bad.There is alot of cheaper things that are good out there.I may buy it,i might not.Also it has nothing to do with i want a new motor as i have that already,i just wanted to try a different brand of motor that most people don't have.

 

[CheapboatKev]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

Wherever whatever is manufactured it is only as good as,

1. The materials it is made from.
2. The tolerances it was built to.
3. The inspection of each stage of assembly.
4. The care and maintenance of whatever it is by the purchaser.

Matters not where the particular item is manufactured.
My 2 cents

100% on this.
Quality of castings, attention to tolerances..Single QUALITY source for raw materials and stringent quality inspections throughout the manuf process.
China factories CAN make very high quality products, and the factory down the street from that one can make a cheaper knock off of a knock off and have junk.

 

[JimS123]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

I have been convinced enough that the 15 will be more then enough power for this boat............. so i have been thinking a 4stroke is set up for that type of fishing compared to a 2stroke.........................would like to get a 20hp tohatsu 4stroke for this boat but it is a little pricey for me at the moment............................i just wanted to try a different brand of motor that most people don't have.

There, you got it! I knew logic would prevail.....LOL. The chinamotor is the ONLY powerplant that meets all of your requirements, so it is your only logical choice.

 

[Cannondale]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

Chinese stuff, like has been said, can be either quite good (typically in factories set up and "managed" by other companies) or horrible.

In my area I dabble in, computers, Chinese-built stuff can be great (motherboards, power supplies, memory, etc. built by the big names in their own Chinese factories) or can be cheap junk and you get less than what you paid for. Search out Chinese capacitors.....absolutely the bottom of the barrel in quality, dependability, and truth in labeling as compared to capacitors made in Taiwan, Japan, etc. I wouldn't own anything that had a Chinese-made capacitor included on its pcb.

Wife's company makes tapered needle roller needle bearings (Torrington/Timken). Timken has a few Chinese plants and all do quality work.

On the other hand, wife's plant outsourced an integral piece, a retainer, for a particular bearing assembly from a Chinese company. What's transpired since then has been horrible......late deliveries, wrong metal used in the retainer's build despite the Chinese company swearing it was the correct metal, tolerances are apparently being measured with a yardstick instead of a micrometer because they're so bad (most of one shipment absolutely did not fit....), company says a delivery is on its way and provides a tracking number of the shipment which turns out to be fake and no shipment arrives when promised, the parts arrive rusty, etc., etc.

Almost every conceivable thing that could be or go wrong with the retainer's production has gone wrong. Some around the plant really feel the Chinese company is just taking their money and thumbing their nose at us because they're so insulated from visits, etc., because of distance. But then a production lot does show up that's properly made, for the most part.

But the U.S. company's production line has repeatedly shut down due to the Chinese issues so often that the company is now investigating absorbing the few cents increased cost of getting the part sourced here in the U.S. Would solve a lot of problems.....and give easy access to the company if issues arise, unlike the Chinese company. And that has caused production lines in other companies to shut down due to lack of finished parts/bearings from us. Not good.

As for what we do personally, we avoid Chinese built products if at all possible. Their clothing doesn't last as long....thinner material, shoddy stitching/sewing, etc. I would buy a durable good from a big name with a Chinese factory, like Mercury, Yamaha, etc. because the company controls production, QC, etc., and isn't left to the Chinese themselves. But to buy a Chinese clone of anything, forget about it. There are reasons it'll be cheaper.....cheaper/lower quality metals, poorer welds, less durable components, and the list goes on.

 

[pecheux]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

I dont know if anybody mentionned it but I read that the HIDEA outboards are made in Australia ... not China. Secondo I would like to beleve buying American would be the right thing to do ... but then I also beleve American companies should hire American employees instead of offshoring jobs to India and Pakistan in order to lower payroll ... but they dont ... soooo when they do I'll consider reading the labels.

 

[boater1234]

Re: new brand of outboards i found today in my marina

Actually they are made in china and sold mostly in austraila and other countries other then the u.s.I found this on the main website if it helps any.

Hangzhou Hidea Power Machinery Co., Ltd. (Hereinafter called Hidea) , located in Hangzhou of China, is one of the most professional manufacturer in outboard motor. It is a high-tec enterprise which integrates R&D, manufacturing and marketing with its own professional team. The annual production capacity reaches 50,000 units.

Hidea owns R&D center, advanced production line, strict testing system and high-efficiency after-sales service system. It cooperates with China First Auto Works Corp. (FAW), who provides strong capital and technological support. Hidea was approved by ISO9001 international quality system, and won many hornors by its excellent performance & steady quality, such as CE, EPA and VCA certificates.

Hidea outboard motors include four-stroke series and two-stroke series. It's an export-oriented enterprise, the products are spreading North America, South America, West Europe, East Europe, Africa and Aisa Pacific countries, such as America, Chile, Germany, Netherlands, Russia, Australia, Vietnam, Israel, South Africa, Egypt etc.

With the concepts of integrity, confidence, observant and innovation, Hidea concentrates on researching and producing environmental products, tries its best to provide better life for humanity. Hidea sincerely welcomes corporations and personalities of all walks of life at home and abroad to establish partnership with us and create a promising future.

For passion, at the exciting moment. For love, in the precious memories. Enjoy quality, enjoy life!