Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

[DJ]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

How about the people who work there?
It ain't gonna kill anyone to go outside & smoke.....
I have seen many people do that & survive with no visible physical harm.....
Other than coughing & hacking , that is......JK

Pick one. First, outside smokers are offensive, second, it' s OK to go outside. Pick one.

The workers have a choice too. They do not have to work there. Or, should government prop up failing businesses because they government made them fail?

Plus, EVERYONE forgets that restaurants and bars frequently offer both (as now allowed to) and have spent serious dollars seperating the two. Forgot that part?

 

[Haut Medoc]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

No one needs to smoke indoors, period....
If ya gotta smoke indoors, stay home!.....JK

 

[DJ]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

No one needs to smoke indoors, period....
If ya gotta smoke indoors, stay home!.....JK

And, when does that go away??? It already has in some communities.

Let's be straight (I know-difficult-for lib's) about this whole issue.

If the anti smoking zealots really wanted to abolish smoking they would rally for the "outlaw" of all tobacco products-PERIOD.

But, they won't. Why? The tax dollars are tremendous. Typical liberal speak. Both sides of the mouth are espousing diametrically opposed beliefs.

It';s all about the money and you call us conservatives-"money grubbing". Hah!

Gee, look at all the millionaires in the Congress, the richest are Dem's.!!!!

 

[CJY]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

DWJ, you said;

"The workers have a choice too. They do not have to work there. Or, should government prop up failing businesses because they government made them fail?"

"If a business allows it, YOU have the choice to enter-or NOT. Nobody's rights are hamapered by that stance. "



With this logic, why have laws at all? If you get run down by a speeding, drunk motorist, it's your own fault? Must be, you went outside when you could have chosen to stay off the road. No speed limits or reckless op laws, stay off the road. Thieves with guns are legal, stay home and keep your doors locked. No leash law, don't go outside. Rapist everywhere on the loose, keep your females home where they don't have to worry. Arsen is no longer against the law, move away from people or build a brick house. Who needs laws to be protected?

Truth is, it does not make sense in today's society that all must fend for themselves or it is their own fault. The stone age has since been long gone. You also have plenty of laws that protect you, even though you must have forgotten them.

 

[KaGee]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

Heard something here yesterday... there may be a loophole. I know of one area where some local bars and restaurants are talking of going private. Entrance by membership only, turning each into a club so to speak.

With this logic, why have laws at all? If you get run down by a speeding, drunk motorist, it's your own fault? Must be, you went outside when you could have chosen to stay off the road. No speed limits or reckless op laws, stay off the road. Thieves with guns are legal, stay home and keep your doors locked. No leash law, don't go outside. Rapist everywhere on the loose, keep your females home where they don't have to worry. Arsen is no longer against the law, move away from people or build a brick house. Who needs laws to be protected?

CJY.... That's just plain silly.

 

[DJ]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

With this logic, why have laws at all? If you get run down by a speeding, drunk motorist, it's your own fault? Must be, you went outside when you could have chosen to stay off the road. No speed limits or reckless op laws, stay off the road. Thieves with guns are legal, stay home and keep your doors locked. No leash law, don't go outside. Rapist everywhere on the loose, keep your females home where they don't have to worry. Arsen is no longer against the law, move away from people or build a brick house. Who needs laws to be protected?

Truth is, it does not make sense in today's society that all must fend for themselves or it is their own fault. The stone age has since been long gone. You also have plenty of laws that protect you, even though you must have forgotten them.

That is completely nonsensical. Nobody ever said "fend for themselves".

However, freedom is NOT free.

Let's talk about guns. Government is hell bent to take them away. By your words, you state who has them-CRIMINALS. Now that makes allot of sense. :-(

Laws are laws to protect us. The roads are PUBLIC domain, restaurants and bars are NOT. They are, as of now, PRIVATE.

We don't have much of a choice when it comes to which roads we drive on. We do when it comes to a bar, restaurant or nightclub. Don't like it, don't go.

As for laws and me. I've never been arrested, never had a speeding ticket or been pulled over, for that matter. So, I understand the laws, do you?

I thought you all were all about "choice". Or is that left to murder a soul to get out of a responsibility?

 

[Haut Medoc]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

No one said anything about outlawing it.....
Just don't smoke indoors where the rest of the non-smoking majority public has to eat, etc.....
How about smoking at the grocery store?
Is that O.K?


Gee, look at all the millionaires in the Congress, the richest are Dem's.!!!!
So, they are obviously smarter!
Tell me something that I didn't know!

 

[crunch]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

Gee, look at all the millionaires in the Congress, the richest are Dem's.!!!!
So, they are obviously smarter!
Tell me something that I didn't know!

Ok.... actually they are bigger thieves. 8)

 

[ZmOz]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

No one needs to smoke indoors, period....
If ya gotta smoke indoors, stay home!.....JK

I agree...I don't even smoke in my own home.

 

[DJ]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

No one said anything about outlawing it.....
Just don't smoke indoors where the rest of the non-smoking majority public has to eat, etc.....
How about smoking at the grocery store?
Is that O.K?

Smoking should not be allowed in a grocery store-unless-it can be segregated. Obviously, to most, it cannot be thus it's not allowed.

Common sense has to prevail here. I know this society is severly lacking in that. If a business owner wants to segregate, that should be HIS/HER choice, NOT YOURS. Yes, you have to eat, there are PLENTY of choices.

I don't smoke in my own house either but that is by MY choice, not YOURS or the governments-FOR NOW.

If you let that camel get his nose under the tent, who knows what else will be banned. And I thought you all were all about choice. Yea right, as long as the choices meet your needs.

That is the definition of selfishness.

 

[Haut Medoc]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

It's a health issue, not a choice issue.....
If you don't like the smoking grocery store, don't shop there...
Or how about the smoking hospital?
Smoking has no place indoors in any business that is open to the public...
Period.....
I am about choice, but not when you are going to do harm to others, when the simple alternative is to go outside....
That's common sense, IMHO.......JK

 

[SS MAYFLOAT]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

Most health departments prohibit smoking where there is food whether it is in a commercial kitchen or grocery store.

I've said this before and I'll say it again, Second hand smoke has been blown way out of proportion. If for a fact second hand smoke will kill you, then I and many others my age should be dead according to the propaganda.

Many people that have lung cancer proclaim to never have been around or have smoked. There is much more pollutants in the air that is harmful that has never had any studies done on them. Tire dust is for one. How many synthetics are there in tires? Brake dust, diesel smoke, insecticides, herbicides, and many more. What is the black stuff that covers your car, the siding on your house, the windows, etc? It sure isn't cigarett smoke.

Like I said earlier, by todays propaganda I SHOULD BE DEAD! My other brother and sisters are alive and well and spent many hours in a car full of our parents smoke. One must keep in mind that many people make their living off of promoting the anti-smoking campaign.

I think in the future the next thing that is going to be hit on is carbonated beverages. They promote diabetes as well as obesity and tooth decay. BTW their is much more health related problems with obesity than those that smoke but way over half our population is over weight. Maybe we need to come up with a bill that only allows obese people to only eat salads at resturants. That way the resturant can't be sued for serving fatting foods like they are trying to do now.

Smelling someones smoke for 30 seconds or so while walking by them is not going to cause harm or death. If and when tobaco is outlawed, be prepared for new taxes on something to make up the millions lost. 1.6 million smokers voted here in Ohio against issue 5. If all those smoked 1 pack a day at the two dollar something tax per pack,,,,,,that is a lot of money. Now how many non smokers want to add a 2 dollar a day tax to their income?Then if both husband and wife smoke 2 packs each a day, well, uh,,,,,,,that is over $8 a day in taxes. That is close to $3,000 a year in that one household. So all of you that hate smokers, are you willing to start paying much higher taxes for outlawing smoking? Got an extra 3 grand to add to your taxes? You know the politicians just love those tax dollars and they aren't going to go without.

This is America and we should have choices with our rights. Take away choices and what exactly what kind of country are we going to have?

 

[crunch]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

Mayfloat for President, 2008. 8)

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

I've said this before and I'll say it again, Second hand smoke has been blown way out of proportion...

Thanks for clearing that up.... :=

Maybe we need to come up with a bill that only allows obese people to only eat salads at resturants.

You might be on to something here! :devil:

 

[CJY]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

"That is completely nonsensical. Nobody ever said "fend for themselves"."

"CJY.... That's just plain silly. "


Why? Have there always been speeding laws, gun laws, rape laws, arsen laws? The answer to that is no, no there have not always been laws to protect us. There too, will be one day when people look back at the smoking laws in disbelief that some were opposed to them.

DWJ, you said;

"If you let that camel get his nose under the tent, who knows what else will be banned. And I thought you all were all about choice. Yea right, as long as the choices meet your needs.

That is the definition of selfishness. "


Reread your statement. You are worried about something you may lose. Namely, your right to smoke where you want. That choice meets your needs, does it not. That sounds mighty selfish to me. I simply have a right to not inhale your smoke. The good thing, at least here in Ohio, I have a law that protects that right. That law by the way, voted and passed by a MAJORITY of Ohio voters. Your opinion is that of a minority. A minority, get it? You are losing the right to do harm to others. Sure, it took away your right to smoke in public, but in my selfish opinion, it was well worth it.

My own definition of selfish is another person believing they have the right to do harm to another person due to their inability or unwillingness to see the difference between right and wrong. I DWJ, do not fit this definition.

SS,

"Smelling someones smoke for 30 seconds or so while walking by them is not going to cause harm or death."

Agreed, if we are talking about 30 seconds, period.

What if it's 30 seconds of every minute? What if two minutes out of every ten? What if it's 30 minutes for lunch and 50 minutes for dinner every day? What if it's eight hours a day while at work, 40 hours a week? What if they work four hours of overtime every day making it 12 hours a day, and 60 hours a week, 240 hours a month? What if that person works 60 hours, bowls on M-W-F for 3 hours at a time. What if........ do you have all the answers for this SS? Exactly how much does it take before it is no longer safe? The short answer, none is always safe, as for any safe amount to inhale, your shooting in the dark.

 

[Haut Medoc]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

Most health departments prohibit smoking where there is food whether it is in a commercial kitchen or grocery store....
Now why do you suppose that is?
If your arguement holds water, why bother with any restrictions at all?
So that means I should be able to fire up a big, fat spliff while court is in session or at the Wallymart??
Which smells far better, btw, than stinky old cigarettes!
My point is:
Smoke all ya want, just take it outside!
I really don't think it's too much to ask.....JK

 

[Haut Medoc]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

I've said this before and I'll say it again, Second hand smoke has been blown way out of proportion...

Thanks for clearing that up.... :=

Maybe we need to come up with a bill that only allows obese people to only eat salads at resturants.

You might be on to something here! :devil:

Frog, I agree!
I would like to add a "No Fat Chicks in Spandex" rider to that piece of legislation....d...JK

 

[DJ]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

Reread your statement. You are worried about something you may lose. Namely, your right to smoke where you want. That choice meets your needs, does it not. That sounds mighty selfish to me. I simply have a right to not inhale your smoke. The good thing, at least here in Ohio, I have a law that protects that right. That law by the way, voted and passed by a MAJORITY of Ohio voters. Your opinion is that of a minority. A minority, get it? You are losing the right to do harm to others. Sure, it took away your right to smoke in public, but in my selfish opinion, it was well worth it.

You completely missed my point.

All you did was take away the right of a business owner to offer both in SEGREGATED areas.

What's next, do you vote on the menus? Now there is a health issue.

 

[QC]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

I do not like smoking in an enclosed area that I am in. I like these laws and the lies that the anti-smoking zealots use even less. The way they teach it in school our kids are effectively being lied to. I would much rather my kid smoked than cheated on a test, but that makes me weird. One is a moral issue, and one is a possible health issue, waaaaay down the road. The immoral behavior is considered OK by most. Plagiarism, cheating, downloading copyrighted material for free all OK. Smoking? Evil. What priorities are we teaching our kids? Discussing moral issues is considered just plain silly, old fashioned, kooky religious right stuff. Tell them that I'd much rather they be a good human than worry about second hand smoke, and even my wife looks at me crosseyed . . . Hmmmmmm.

And then there is the slippery slope. Silly? New York City is trying to ban trans fats in all restaurants . . . My silly city does not allow caffeinated coffee at the little league snack bar.

Oh, but KFC, just voluntarily eliminated trans fats. Can't trust business, they'll kill you to make a buck . . . Hmmmmmm.

 

[Haut Medoc]

Re: Ohio issues 4 and 5 on smoking

So, what's yer point?