Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

[system-f]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

I saw a 260 and drive on CL for 350.00. I can get you the number is you want to go look. It is in Burleson.

Probably the same one I saw, Jay. I am going to have to wait before spending any more money on the boat unless it is for paint. I have a good engine that really looks like it only has 300 hours on it as my meter says and I should stick with it for now. If the lower unit of that 260 is good and it is available end of January I might pick it up.

Today I only got one layer of CSM on the main three stringers and I am 100% confident in the strength, but hate the way it looks. PL is some tough stuff, but it makes filling the gap between the stringer and hull very hard. The CSM is stuck to the hull with little to no air bubbles and stuck to the stringer with little to no air bubble, but in between there are unavoidable gaps.

The good news is I didn't use nearly as much resin as I thought and have at least 7 gallons left. I was forced to thin the resin out with acetone in order to get it to flow properly and though this maybe bad form it really seemed to remove a lot of air bubbles. I have enough CSM tape left to do a full 12" on each side of the stringers which will overlap between the center and outer stringers creating a good bond and extra strength. Then of course the entire thing gets gone over with 1708 12" tape. I cannot get the csm to wrap over the tops of the stringers without coming off and bunching up. I have some thinner 7oz cloth I may use to cover the stringers, but they are so saturated in glass I am really not concerned about water getting into them.

Overall I am happy with my first major fiberglass job. It is NO WHERE near professional or as good looking as Chris Hayes' job, but my angels are very tight and I am guessing Poly doesn't stick like epoxy would. With just the stringers being bedded with PL the hull feels much more ridged and this is already one huge step above how the stringers were bedded before (they weren't). As long as my glass buildup along each side is substatial and the bonding to the hull is good my boat will be fine.

Pictures later, I am too tired today to snap any and there is a lot of CSM on tops of the stringers that has to be cut off in the transom area.

 

[Friscoboater]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

Man I had the same problems! The CSM was everywhere and there were unavoidable gaps in some places. I am so frustrated!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[system-f]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

I am so frustrated!!!!!!!!!!!!

The gaps bother me and I am actually quite embarrassed of the way it looks now (when compared to work like Chris Hayes), but the truth is even with these gaps my bonding to the required surfaces is good. Given the extra amount of mat and biax I am to put down and the massive areas covered PLUS the PL bond to the hull I have no doubts what so ever the boat will be stronger than it ever was and much much much more water proof. The hull is already more stable than it was when I first pulled the floor.

Did you try thinning the resin? We did so by 20% with acetone and were immediately able to get better coverage, make the mat conform much more easily, and able to reduce air bubbles. I realize this reduces the strength of the resin, but we used much more and were able to achieve more adhesion.


How much area are you covering Jay? I have enough 1708 12" tape left over that if you need a yard or two you are welcome to it. Once you feel the 1708 your doubts about any strength issues will go away.

 

[Friscoboater]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

I only have a little left to do. I need to go over the little part of the stringer and the backside of the transom. I would be glad to pay you for it.

 

[BobsGlasstream]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

Keith,
It sounds like you are well on your way. I'll be looking forward to seeing the pic's.
Whatever you did I'm sure it will be far better then the original.
When I tore out my old wood I found massive areas that had no resin or glass on them at all.
Keep the faith.
Keep rolling man.
Bob

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

You can pick up plastic squeegees at any auto parts store, they're used as body filler spreaders. The type a glass shop uses are different, but these will work fine.

Buy the cheapest fuzzy rollers you can find at a large chain store, typically a 6 or 8 pack for 5 to 8 bucks. These will work well for doing the larger areas.

Getting the air out of only 1 layer of glass is harder than 2 or more, so if possible do all of the layup at one time.

Acetone isn't a good idea, especially at 20%, you should try a fiberglass roller if you?re still having problems after doing more than one layer of glass at a time.

 

[system-f]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

I tried the fuzzy rollers and the resin just seems too thick too go into the glass. Maybe I am not waiting long enough, but I am worried my pot is going to start to gel at 12oz per pot.

Acetone isn't a good idea, especially at 20%, you should try a fiberglass roller if you?re still having problems after doing more than one layer of glass at a time.

I was having trouble getting the one layer of CSM to suck up the resin.

Since this was the first layer of CSM, and it does seem to have cured nicely, I will try full strength tomorrow on the second layer and the 1708. I guess I should just do the second layer and 1708 at the same time?

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

Are you pre-wetting the surface before laying the glass down and then putting more resin on top?

If that doesn't work you need to find another resin supplier, or see if they have a different product that will wet out the glass better.

 

[system-f]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

Yes, I am pre-wetting. How much should I pre-wet, maybe I am not putting enough down. So far I have only done small tabbing strips on the stringers. Tomorrow I put down the wide stuff to encapsulate the stringers.

Another problem I am having is getting the CSM to lay over the stringer. It seems to want to come off the wood on the sides. I was thinking about laying it down and then using some strips of wood coating in something the resin wouldn't stick to so it would be held until cure. Maybe 1 1/2oz csm is too thick to wrap around the 1" wide stringer?


I am using US Composites general layup Poly resin. I didn't have any problems wetting out the glass on the transom using the same glass and resin so I really hope this isn't a problem with either.

I did use the foam rollers on the transom and they worked great on the but quickly fell apart after 30min of use. The cotton type roller doesn't seem to spread as much resin and really requires force to get the resin out of the roller.

Grrr, now I want to get back out there and start working on this problem.

 

[system-f]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

So I went back out and tried it again laying down some 12" wide strips of 1 1/2oz CSM on the stringers. I am happy with what I just did and got the CSM to conform much better to the hull except where there were PL buggers I missed. I found that my cotton type rollers work fine but I just have to be more gentle with it and use the putty knife to work the corners while I rolled.

I also did a small test piece to try and cap the stringer and this did work better than before but I am not getting the mat to lay down 100% on the corners. Why is this csm not laying down on the top of the stringers? it is ALMOST there but not all the way.

 

[vegasphotoman]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

it just wont, the only way to get it to set down is to have filets and super rounded stringer top edges....it will set on arcs but not on 90degree angles...pops up from the stiffness of the fiberglass cloth and catches air bubbles....

I attempted stapling some sharp angled top outside corners ...it was a BAD IDEA....it did hold it down, but it made for depressions near the staples, plus the staples will rust and allow water in etc...trust me its not a good idea...

 

[system-f]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

I found out my problems with not getting a good wet out:

1. Not wetting enough before putting the resin down. Pouring resin behind the glass and rolling it through fixed that issue.

2. Not using enough resin. I did a 1 1/2oz mat + 1708 layup in one round and it took a ton of resin on that 10ft by 12" stretch. I was told that this was the max to do with poly due to the heat buildup.

We finished the layup on the center stringer today except for the rear section under the oil pan. I still have tons of bubbled section due to PL buggers but it went together better than I hoped. We also added tons of 1708 to the center section of the Hull which went down perfectly due to the flatness of the hull and the prep grinding. Adhesion on the old glass looks great. Adhesion to the flat surfaces of the wood looks great. Basically what it all boils down to is I should have sanded the PL spots down flat. PL is some messy stuff to work with and I know my boat will be very strong, but at my level of discipline I might have been better off to go with mixing peanut butter for the bedding to get a smoother surface.


Glassing is messy work and this is my first time to do anything significant. I plan on keeping this boat for a long time and feel very confident working on smooth surfaces, but I have a long way to go. I want to thank everyone for their help.

I still have another layer of CSM to go on the other two stringers and one layer to cap the back floor supports.

My last question has to do with the tops of the stringers. Should I bother capping them with CSM? I know they need to be sealed from water, but it dosen't seem this stuff will truely cover them and hold to the sharp angles? I am running kind of low on 1708 12" tape (10 yds), but have tons of 1 1/2oz 12" csm left.

 

[Friscoboater]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

Sounds like we both had a baptism by fire today. Does you whole body itch?

 

[system-f]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

I have gotten use to the itching and still have so much more left to go. Right now I am so ticked off at the way everything looks, but I know it is strong. At this point I am just taking my time, trying to seal everything up, and making sure it looks better than it did before I pulled it apart. I already have 1 full layer of CSM on the stringers than stock so...

 

[Friscoboater]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

I am not real happy about the look of mine either.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

2. Not using enough resin. I did a 1 1/2oz mat + 1708 layup in one round and it took a ton of resin on that 10ft by 12" stretch. I was told that this was the max to do with poly due to the heat buildup.


The number of layers that can be done at one time depends on the resin, catalyst%, type and weight of the glass plus ambient temperature.

The layup will get hot and start to change color if its too thick, just getting warm is normal. Try a small section with all the glass you plan to use at one time, two 1708 and one mat would be a typical layup being done at one time.

 

[system-f]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

two 1708 and one mat would be a typical layup being done at one time.

Holy crap!!! Would that be done by a home amateur or is that more of a professional type layup?

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

Holy crap!!! Would that be done by a home amateur or is that more of a professional type layup?


Either way, the resin and glass can't tell which one you are.

 

[system-f]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

The resin can see right through me; it knows I am an inexperienced amatuer.

Thank you again for your help. If you see me screw up please pop in and let me know, ondarvr or other glass-gurus.

 

[vegasphotoman]

Re: Poor Man's Skiboat...Restore?

you know I hear about people "itching" from the fiberglass, we didnt get itchy at all.......hmmmm........interesting,, very interesting....

Tell ya what, the temp makes quite a difference, when we did our glassing it was 115 degrees out with low humidity....man it set fast! we let ours dry for atleast an hour between coats.