Roofing Thoughts

[SS MAYFLOAT]

Before air nailers, of course I used the old hammer way. I've used air nailers and have always thought they were better as well as faster.

I had an argument from a gentleman that said air nailers don't do the job as the old fashioned hammer. I didn't press my point on air nailers as this was the type of guy that seemed to be dead set in his ways.

My take is that when using a hammer, the number of strokes would seem to rattle the structure and cause stress with the blows. An air nailer drives them in with the use of inertia with minimal damage to the underlying stucture.

Just curious what some of your opinions are. I'm talking nails, NOT staples,,,,,,I hate staples, they don't hold as well as a large headed roofing nail. Thanks..........SS

 

[Kenneth Brown]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

My take on this.....

If the structure can't take hammer blows then you probably shouldn't be standing on it anyhow. The air nailer will change depth as the pressure rises and falls, even 15 pounds makes a difference. For a quality build I suggest good old fashioned hammer. That being said I have 2 framing nailers, 2 brad/T nail guns, and used to have a coil nailer.

 

[zoe'sdad]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

I would have to say the hammer. A group of workers with a nail bag and hammers can lay the roof just as fast without having to worry about moving air hoses or loosing power. Same goes for framing or hanging drywall using nails instead of screws. In an application such as installing asphalt shingles on the back of a parapet where you have to hold the tab up and nail it, then I would choose the nail gun.

 

[rwise]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

I have seen staples and hand nails on houses next to each other. After a storm they both had the same damage, just a few 3 tab shingles blown off on each.

 

[SpinnerBait_Nut]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

What about a metal roof over existing roof?
Screws, nails?

 

[Bigprairie1]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

Well, I've done a few full roofs...all by hammer. They are still good. That said, I don't know if I would throw out the new 'automation/technology' air nailers too soon without a fair shake.
I'd like to try one first (at least not an air nailer for roofing). I love air tools and for the better part they make quick work of what used to be all manual. That said, I'd never frame any woodwork with one...I screw 90%+ of everything wood I build...no nails if I can avoid it.
(....speaking of which, I'm due for a new roof within the next five years I think...yikes)

 

[gss036]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

I think the big secret with 3 tab is to get it installed early in the spring so you have all summer for the sun to melt the tar strips for a good stick down. That way I don't think it would matter. I definately would not go with staples on asphalt.
On the question of metal roofs, I would alway go w/screws to avoid(helps hold better) leaks. On metal roofs, the screw/nail goes on top of a ridge in the metal sheeting. Best results can be had with the snap together type.

 

[Kenneth Brown]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

That said, I'd never frame any woodwork with one...I screw 90%+ of everything wood I build...no nails if I can avoid it.
QUOTE]

While I somewhat agree that screws are always better than nails doing framing with them is a no-no. It is against code to use screws to frame with. During an earth quake, tornado, huricane or other strong force a nail will have a certain amount of give to it. A screw on the other hand will snap. Building our house I was my own contractor so I could pretty much specify what was used. I paid extra for ring shank nails and I used them everywhere. The were no smooth shanks used anywhere in my house and I believe it shows. We haven't had any flooring pop but of course we also used a gazillion tubes of subfloor adhesive too. One area that we did use screws was building the handrails around the deck/porch and on the stairs for it.




For a metal roof always go with screws. For corrugated tin you go through the highs, for R and U panels you go in the flat.

 

[i386]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

That reminded me of an article I read a while back. Interesting stuff...

10 - DIRECT LINKS - Please do not post direct, clickable links to any commercial operation other than iboats.com. It is acceptable to post the address as a referral in a non-clickable form.

 

[newbie4life]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

I'll stick my neck out there against you 'old-farts' and their hammers.

I used to only use a shingler's hammer. Worked great. Was told once that a good shingler could out run a coil nailer any day of the week -- so I tried it. In fact, we raced.

There's absolutely NO way that you can do it faster with a hammer. I used to do it in two swings... once to set the nail, the last to drive it in. And, fast... While I was driving in a second nail, the next one was on the shingle ready to go.

With a coil nailer, I can sweep the shingle 4 times, and it's done. No digging for more nails. One coil puts on a bundle of shingles. No matter how you look at it, it's faster. As for over/under pressure, I turn the pressure all the way up at the compressor, then use a smaller pressure regulator at the gun. This way, I'm in complete control, and don't have to climb down to change any settings.

I also feel the same way as many on here about the staples. I've not used the stapler, and I don't plan on ever using it. We took off a roof a few weeks back that was stapled on... I gotta tell you, though... the staples didn't want to come out very well. With a roofing nail, I can dig in under it with the shingle shovels... with the staple, it usually breaks the staple before letting go.

I completely agree though... make sure you roof in the spring. Right now is not roofing weather up here (Wisconsin).

 

[FLATHEAD]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

I agree with newbie. Your just being hardheaded not using a good air nailer. Hand nailed is OK but old school and twice as slow. As far as framing with screws. BIG MISTAKE. Especially if your framing anything where sheer strength comes into play. Those screws will snap then you'll be screwed. Not to mention it would take forever to get anything done. Air nailer are good here too. You get way less splits in the studs and plates with an air nailer.

As far as the drywall comment. Screws are the way to go. A good rocker can screw two sheet of rock on a bad day faster than the best nailer can nail one sheet. And nail pops are pretty well eliminated.

 

[SS MAYFLOAT]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

This spring I plan to do a tear off and put the 30 year shingles on. My trusses are 24"OC with 1/2" plywood. There hasn't been any leaks, but if I don't do something by next year, I think I will have some problems.

I've use both on jobs throughout the years. Mostly hammers in my younger days since roofing nailers wasn't around yet. After I got my taste of one on a job, I gotta say I like them better for the fact you don't have to grab nails, smash your fingers, and deal with guys who can't the head of a nail.

Interesting thoughts and good reading.........Thanks.....SS

 

[FLATHEAD]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

SS. Are you sure it's 1/2 inch? Even with clips, that plywood has probably sagged pretty well between the trusses.

Not sure where you live but if your up north make sure you use ice and water shield along the eaves, valleys, pipe collars, chimney and any other penetrations.

 

[SS MAYFLOAT]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

SS. Are you sure it's 1/2 inch? Even with clips, that plywood has probably sagged pretty well between the trusses.

Not sure where you live but if your up north make sure you use ice and water shield along the eaves, valleys, pipe collars, chimney and any other penetrations.

My house was built in 54 during the time of new construction methods. My neighbor that lives next door was there when the house was built. He said it was one of the first houses in this area to use plywood sheating for the roof. It does get a bit scarey walking around on it. Just got to learn to space yourself on the trusses. I have only one layer of shingles, but with the sheating being so thin, that is why I'm going to do a tear off. Codes sez I can put another layer on top, but I just don't like the idea of that extra weight up there when a big ole snow storm hits.

The house doesn't have any sheilds but will have them when I do the new roof.

 

[newbie4life]

Re: Roofing Thoughts

"The house doesn't have any sheilds but will have them when I do the new roof."

Actually, Ice and Water Shield or Ice and Water Guard -- it's a rolled product, that looks similar to roofing felt. It has an adhesive back to it that bonds itself to the roof deck.