Starmada Testing Laboratories

[barato2]

i suspect we're one of the biggest tinhead sites on the web and as such, have an obligation to develop some data for our bretheren and sisteren in tin.

given all the discussion about various plywood options for floors n transoms, i decided to run the grand water intrusion/delamination test. gathered samples of: birch ply, oak ply, Arauco ply, marine ply, solid red oak, and various examples of these coated with differing levels of various goops (spar varnish and epoxy). filled old cat litter bucket with water and a little deterg for wetting agent. stuck all samples in an old salad tub and inverted it in bottom of bucket, then stuck an old mushroom anchor on top to keep it all submerged.

pretty crude, but i think it will give us accurate enough data for our purposes. if anyone has modification to suggest, toss it out there.

plan is to shoot pix at periodic intervals so you can see for yourself what each option does after 1,2,3 weeks underwater.

if no one else tests the flotation of pool noodles, that's next on the list.

 

[DirtyHarry83]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

if no one else tests the flotation of pool noodles, that's next on the list.

I believe multiple tests on the noodles is a good idea. My shipment of noodles should be in tomorrow. If I can find time I'll try and test the flotation.

I'd like to note when testing flotation I'd recommend an even spread rather than just ting off a rope to a mushroom anchor. If the weight is distributed like it would be in between the hull and the deck it may fair better. I wish I had an old dive belt.

 

[DirtyHarry83]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

Another good site that has done some testing.

It may be good to compare to...

http://www.epoxyproducts.com/

This site above is where I ordered my epoxy from. It's pretty interesting read. It's a little rough on the eyes (the site layout) but if you can get past that it's nice information.

 

[barato2]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

that's a good idea to use dive weights as i was wondering how to incrementally add weight. i do still have a bunch; now just gotta line up a freind with a pool........

 

[InMotion]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

Great idea B2...

The pool noodles I bought were rated for 200lbs... I cannot remember the diameter --- but 2 3/4" rings a bell.

Now what would be really interesting is to not just expose the wood to straight water... but water for 1 week, air for 1 week etc to truly simulate what a boat would go through. I suspect you many have troubles with "snow" / "cold" testing!

 

[DirtyHarry83]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

that's a good idea to use dive weights as i was wondering how to incrementally add weight. i do still have a bunch; now just gotta line up a freind with a pool........

Thanks I try to think up some good ideas haha!

 

[barato2]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

IM, you might be surprised....last year, i saw 4 degrees one night here in the flatlands, and at our place in the mountains (abt 7400'), they see 10 below most winters. but durability testing of that nature would take years andinvolve more facilities than i have.

that particular lie by the pool noodle mfgrs (200 lbs) is one reason i want to test em. i'd be surrpised if they float more than 15% of that.

 

[Bwana Don]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

I like this. Being an engineer I've thought out a few tests in my mind. Glad to see someone actually doing testing in a scientific manner.

We are Starmada strong!

 

[CheapboatKev]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

ya know...If we all were to pull all of our resources and back ground skills..I bet we could give UL a run for the money.
Me, I sell light bulbs, its my thing..what can I add to this?
How about accelerated exposure to UV sound to test epoxy, resin...gluvit..all the common rehab materials.

Of course we would need to come up with a "approved" logo..oh an acrynim too..Something like.."S.H.I.T"
Starmada Has Intensley Tested.

That way when we recommend a product we can say.."Yaaa..That stuff is the S.H.I.T"

lol

 

[64osby]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

CBK Funny.

Last year I stuck some of the old style styrofoam in a Starmada approved cat litter container for 4 months. Took the weight off of it and it popped right to the top. It was rusty from the weight I used.

I should have weighed it before and after to see if it absorbed much water, if any.

 

[DirtyHarry83]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

ya know...If we all were to pull all of our resources and back ground skills..I bet we could give UL a run for the money.
Me, I sell light bulbs, its my thing..what can I add to this?
How about accelerated exposure to UV sound to test epoxy, resin...gluvit..all the common rehab materials.

Of course we would need to come up with a "approved" logo..oh an acrynim too..Something like.."S.H.I.T"
Starmada Has Intensley Tested.

That way when we recommend a product we can say.."Yaaa..That stuff is the S.H.I.T"

lol

I laughed at the title... That's awesome. I pick up my floats tomorrow but like Barato I need to find a pool and I need to find a weight belt. It would be interesting to see them all tied down and spread evenly.

Could also test the tunes and see if they gain weight after the tests. Really proving that they do not hold water...
Although the way I look at it... the idea of flotation is to try and keep it dry as long as possible.

 

[cutbait76]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

Maybe I can add to the scientific testing!

I have all the O.G. styro from the boat, and plan on putting it back in along with selective squirts of expanda foam. Expanda foam is only intended to keep the styro from shifting and squeeking and will be used minimally.

Since this rig has been out of the water since 01 I will test its weight/water absorbtion compared to sheet stryo from Home Depot.

Is it even worth it? Doesn't seem too many are much into reusing the O.G. styro?

 

[jasoutside]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

Heads up: noodles are rated at a 200# person (or 100# person as the case may be) who actually already has buoyancy. I'd guess they are closer to 10# or 15# of dead weight.

Mad alum boat scientists everywhere, scary!

 

[MichaelP]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

This could take years to get any valuable results, somehow the process should be accelerated. I'm a mechanical designer with 6 sigma training and R&D background so I might be able to help. I'm not a ME but I onced played one on TV ;-) . It's important to define how you will measure one against the other. Density and physical size would be 2 ways for sure. Make each specimen as close to the same size as possible and document L W H and mass. Now define the process. I believe exposure to all the realistic elements are important, hot, cold, wet, dry and UV in alternating or sequential defined periods. Define the variables: If you take each material you listed and put different coatings on each it adds up to alot of pieces. I'd include one of each that are uncoated for a base line. This all holds true for the foam test except UV may not be so important since our flotation is usually covered. Another way to do this would be to gather old samples of each of thess taken from old boats. Observatios frome these can be used to validate results from your controlled test. Maybe your local university has a lab that can help with the acceleration part.

S.H.I.T is IT !!!

DH - I've talked to Dr Epoxy and he's a wealth of information. Used his stuff on resto #1 and will on #3.

 

[starcrafter65]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

Whelp - I am an engineer - :facepalm: - and I develop products with foam !!

Here is the ugly truth - all foam - EPS, Noodles, EXP, PolyIso, Poured.....will turn into a saturated gob of goo very similar in density to actual water - if - if - it is put in an environment of constant water. The water will wick into the voids eventually if left in continuous contact with H2O.

I would suggest that all renovators/restorers/starmadians when putting floatation in - maintain water evacuation channels out of your tinnie - and pull the plug for the drive home.

Nobody likes a soggy bottom!!

 

[64osby]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

Starmada Products - Made with fine craftsmanship, utilizing materials that may be better than original.*


* Actual finished products may not reflect the manufactures specifications or intent. Results are non typical and subject to the owners biased opinions. Please contact the nearest Starmada member for additional skewed real world results.

 

[lakelover]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

Whelp - I am an engineer - :facepalm: - and I develop products with foam !!

Here is the ugly truth - all foam - EPS, Noodles, EXP, PolyIso, Poured.....will turn into a saturated gob of goo very similar in density to actual water - if - if - it is put in an environment of constant water. The water will wick into the voids eventually if left in continuous contact with H2O.

I would suggest that all renovators/restorers/starmadians when putting floatation in - maintain water evacuation channels out of your tinnie - and pull the plug for the drive home.

Nobody likes a soggy bottom!!

Thanks for posting the actual facts from first hand experience!

 

[DirtyHarry83]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

This thread is awesome. Not only is it informative but it's bathed in humor.

I like the suggestions here and advice given. I just never see myself leaving my 18 SS with water in the hull. I don't leave boats in the water except when I go to Lake Raystown. After that trip it lives on the trailer with the plug out for air drying.

Nobody likes a soggy bottom!!

Nor a soggy gooey noodle!

 

[DirtyHarry83]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

DH - I've talked to Dr Epoxy and he's a wealth of information. Used his stuff on resto #1 and will on #3.

Yeah I need to read more into that site. I got the ideas from his Epoxy's that more than 1 layer is required, 2 would be advisable and for the over engineering type in me.

I will probably push for 3 layers. First layer thinned for absorption and the 2nd, 3rd layers a bit thicker. All layers applied within 20 hours of each other to create that kind of bond that makes you feel good inside.
Finally a coat of gray pant on the bottom of my deck. Why? Because I don't want life to thrive there in any form! A baron waste land of under deck lifelessness!

 

[Brenn]

Re: Starmada Testing Laboratories

I agree this is an awesome thread.I also like the S.H.I.T. idea,lol