Water Patrol

[Drowned Rat]

Re: Water Patrol

The 4th amendment is not being violated with these safety checks. They are not searching or seizing anything during the normal course of a safety inspection. When they board your vessel and ask for your safety equipment, as long as you can produce it, nothing else is required. They don't look in any compartments. If you can't produce a piece of safety equipment or if they see anything is plain view that is suspicious, then they have reasonable cause to search for additional infractions. If you have a weapon on board, some officers prefer for you to leave it be and, depending on the boat, they are happy with that. Others will insist on securing the weapon which of course will mean going into the compartment where it is kept and securing it. If anything is seen in plain view by the officer while he is securing that weapon, probable cause exists. The owner has no "reasonable" expectation of privacy where that weapon is kept. So that is helpful information for the educated boater. Don't store your pot (or your contraband of choice) and your weapons in the same compartment!

This of course does not apply to marine industry professionals who are licensed to perform their duties. These individuals subject themselves to searches voluntarily as a condition of their licensure.

 

[royal0014]

Re: Water Patrol

If you think LEOS doing safety checks are a pain, you need to join a local Rescue Squad and pull a few dead people out of the water. Humans as a species are inheirently stupid. Don't believe that? Check out the prison population!

 

[DrWiffel]

Re: Water Patrol

So is this your first boat? Safety checks are nothing new, they are a minor inconvienience and probabally keep a lot of folks from drowing themselves (in the water or liquor). In 10 years I've been pulled over 3 times, never more than 10 minutes for a quick lifejacket/throwable/fire extinguisher check and we were on our way.

The police are pretty respectfull about picking a good time to pull you over too. We were out skiing on Minnetonka yesterday when a patrol boat started circling, saw him pull someone over and then they sat and floated watching us for a while but must have decided that either we looked OK or they didn't want to screw up the relatively calm water we had

Calm water on Minnetonka? Seems like a rare occurrence, especially on a weekend.

The boat I have now is actually my second boat not including the canoes that I?ve had in the past. Last year was my fist boat in a wile however. My parents sold my last on one me when I was activated to go over seas in the military.

After reading some of the posts here; I would have to say safety inspections should be done at the boat launch only. Once you?re out on the water, it seems a little late to be doing a ?Safety Inspection? because all safety measures should have already been taken before you even put in. It almost seems like an attempt for a money grab to maybe catch someone off guard.

As far as the 4th amendment is considered. It is somewhat of an unreasonable search (as said before a slippery slope). If you?re driving your car, an officer can?t pull you over to do a ?safety check?. They have to first have a reason to turn their lights on; otherwise it could be considered harassment (I think). Though I?m sure if an officer wanted to pull someone over he/she could just make something up. I do agree that they are out there for a reason, and that is to keep people safe, and it didn?t bother me all that much, but I still get a little nervous being questioned by officers even if I know I did nothing wrong, but there?s that chance that I may have missed something and get slapped with a $170 ticket or something over something stupid that wasn?t obvious (it can happen to anyone). If you?re minding your own business and appear to be being safe, you should be left alone.

 

[oldjeep]

Re: Water Patrol

Calm water on Minnetonka? Seems like a rare occurrence, especially on a weekend.

Halsteds bay is usually pretty decent along the shoreline.

 

[smokeonthewater]

Re: Water Patrol

So what "freedom" are you losing when they check your boat for safety?

the freedom to continue on my way to where I had chosen to stop instead of where they want me to stop.... I tolerate inspections but in america our legal system declares us innocent until proven guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt but in reality we are treated as if we are guilty but only free until they catch us in the act....

I would be much less bothered though if they did a better job of enforcing laws against the actual criminal acts instead of being lazy and just relying on tickets from casual inspections for revenue.... nothing like being buzzed by jetskis all day and getting a ticket because your flares (which still worked fine) are a few months out of date .... true story

 

[roostonu]

Re: Water Patrol

that's the way i see it too..

that said. i assume any leo can pull ya over for no reason what so ever. guess ya better have yer ducks in a row at all times. just part of boating i guess.

So checking that you have all the necessary safety equipment is pulling you over for no reason what so ever?

The only people I have ever heard complain about laws being inforced are the ones breaking them.

 

[roostonu]

Re: Water Patrol

that's the way i see it too..

that said. i assume any leo can pull ya over for no reason what so ever. guess ya better have yer ducks in a row at all times. just part of boating i guess.

The world would be a much better place if everyone had their ducks in a row at all times.

 

[smokeonthewater]

Re: Water Patrol

The only people I have ever heard complain about laws being inforced are the ones breaking them.

I'm all for laws being enforced.... I just want to see them ALL inforced.... Including the ones that apply to policing agencies

 

[DrWiffel]

Re: Water Patrol

So checking that you have all the necessary safety equipment is pulling you over for no reason what so ever?

The only people I have ever heard complain about laws being inforced are the ones breaking them.

That's kind of like saying "if you got nothing to hide then don't worry about it". Kind of a dangerous way to look at it.

 

[roostonu]

Re: Water Patrol

I think what freedoms that are being hurt are the freedom of choice. For example seatbelts, helmets, where you can and can't smoke, what you can and can't have in your yard, the list goes on and on. Most of the time when a law/statute is created, a there is a choice that is being taken away, and being able to make those choices is freedom, and the freedom to learn from our mistakes. Even if that means being able to make a choice that can be viewed as unsafe or wrong.

We have individual freedoms. I do agree with you about seat belts and individual safety but, no one but yourself is at risk when you don't wear it (thin line here). Everyone around you is at risk when you disregard safety on a boat. You do not and should not have the right to learn by your mistakes when others safety is at risk by you hands. I said thin line before because, sometimes your own disregard for safety can still put others at risk. Often times, our own disregard for our own personal safety puts fire and rescue personal at risk when they have to save your *** because you wanted to take some risks.

 

[dingbat]

Re: Water Patrol

That's kind of like saying "if you got nothing to hide then don't worry about it". Kind of a dangerous way to look at it.

Becouse of when and where I boat, I get checked an average to 5-6 times a season even though I'm a Coast Guard inspected craft. I could care less. I have nothing to hide. Why is that dangerous? There are a lot more things to worry about in life than a CG inspection.

 

[roostonu]

Re: Water Patrol

THIS FREEDOM

United States Constitution
Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Asking you to show equipment is not a "search or seizure" and making sure you are operating safely around others is hardly "unreasonable". The safety of others operating around you is "probable cause".

 

[Fl_Richard]

Re: Water Patrol

this freedom

united states constitution
amendment iv

the right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

+10000000000000

 

[roostonu]

Re: Water Patrol

That's kind of like saying "if you got nothing to hide then don't worry about it". Kind of a dangerous way to look at it.

"Kind of a dangerous way to look at it" What?????

 

[smokeonthewater]

Re: Water Patrol

Becouse of when and where I boat, I get checked an average to 5-6 times a season even though I'm a Coast Guard inspected craft. I could care less. I have nothing to hide. Why is that dangerous? There are a lot more things to worry about in life than a CG inspection.

That is dangerous because the rights and freedoms you do not actively protect are the rights and freedoms that you lose.... Those that would abuse your rights will continue along that path until forced to stop.... Ask the american indians how well trusting the government to look out for their rights worked out....


Imagine catching an afternoon nap in your home and hearing a knock at the door along with "POLICE OPEN UP" ... You answer the door and an officer says he is coming in for a safety inspection. He explains that he is comming in to make sure you have smoke detectors and that your home is up to code. He says he must go into the room where your infant child is sleeping to make sure the crib is safe..... Laughable right? Of course it won't happen right?

Now imagine going back 50-75 years and tell folks they could be pulled over and ticketed for not having a seatbelt on even at 10 mph on a remote road..... or stopped in a boat without being observered committing any offense and boarded for a (mandatory) safety inspection...... They would laugh at you too.



Now if it were suggested and put to a vote that we would have optional safety inspections that if passed would entitle me to an exemption to a new $20 "safety enforcement" fee added to my annual boat registration I would be all for it....

 

[jonesg]

Re: Water Patrol

If you think LEOS doing safety checks are a pain, you need to join a local Rescue Squad and pull a few dead people out of the water. Humans as a species are inheirently stupid. Don't believe that? Check out the prison population!

And graveyards are full of genuises.

2 people already dead in Mass this yr, hit a breakwater at WOT in the dark.
My dad used to say "thats EASY, even I could do that".

Last yr I read about a family of 10 in a bowrider getting swamped trying to go out the merrimack river into the ocean, no lifejackets, lucky there was a lot of boats around.

Non boaters buy a boat and think its a jeep or an auto, its just like taking a spin through the country....sure.

 

[cribber]

Re: Water Patrol

Last time I got safety checked, the guy just sort of laughed at the end and said, "How big is this boat, anyhow?" Mostly, they don't bother the old white-haired, white-bearded guy in the 12' aluminum boat.

That cracked me up... thanks!!!!

I keep my craft legal and my passengers safe. If they want to do a spot check I'm more than happy to let them check me out. Usually next time I see the same officer all we get a wave hello. Thanks LCSO for keeping us safe out on the Harris Chain!!!

 

[JoLin]

Re: Water Patrol

That is dangerous because the rights and freedoms you do not actively protect are the rights and freedoms that you lose.... Those that would abuse your rights will continue along that path until forced to stop.... Ask the american indians how well trusting the government to look out for their rights worked out....


Imagine catching an afternoon nap in your home and hearing a knock at the door along with "POLICE OPEN UP" ... You answer the door and an officer says he is coming in for a safety inspection. He explains that he is comming in to make sure you have smoke detectors and that your home is up to code. He says he must go into the room where your infant child is sleeping to make sure the crib is safe..... Laughable right? Of course it won't happen right?

Now imagine going back 50-75 years and tell folks they could be pulled over and ticketed for not having a seatbelt on even at 10 mph on a remote road..... or stopped in a boat without being observered committing any offense and boarded for a (mandatory) safety inspection...... They would laugh at you too.



Now if it were suggested and put to a vote that we would have optional safety inspections that if passed would entitle me to an exemption to a new $20 "safety enforcement" fee added to my annual boat registration I would be all for it....

For what it's worth, I agree. I have a voluntary inspection done every year and display the sticker. I do NOT expect to be boarded if I'm minding my own business and doing nothing wrong. I haven't been to date, but I wouldn't be real happy about it if it happened.

My .02

 

[ziggy]

Re: Water Patrol

I agree. I have a voluntary inspection done every year and display the sticker. I do NOT expect to be boarded if I'm minding my own business and doing nothing wrong. I haven't been to date, but I wouldn't be real happy about it if it happened.

while i agree and i also get the sticker from my local usgc aux (not yet this year, but i have intentions). i don't think that this is ticket to not getting hassled. the leo's don't care about a sticker, + i only get one sticker. port side only. what if they observe me from starboard. they don't see the sticker..

 

[jimmyzshack]

Re: Water Patrol

I have been stopped and check at least 6 times in the past 3 years that i have owned a boat. Every Memorial day i have been stopped and i'm sure i will be this weekend.