1960 Luger Matador Restoration

[FJ_Russo]

So I have always looked at those beautiful wooden run-a bouts and dreamt about owning one. Finally the misses gave me the ok and I started looking at some. I looked at a few Thompson's and two Wagemakers. I wanted an outboard, for my own comfort level and I love the look of a late 50's OMC. I wanted one about 14' long so it was easy to store and work on. I came across a Luger Matador in Springfield OH.

Looking at the Luger brand, they were produced by sears as kit boats. which made me slightly reluctant. However after a few conversation with the PO I decided to make the 6 hour trip and take a look.

i was AMAZED this thing was 53 years old and in great shape. no rot anywhere to be found, definitely had been stored inside like the the PO said. So I bought it for 800.00 a little more than I was wanted to spend but I felt it was worth it. Here is what she looked like the day I bought her.

 

[FJ_Russo]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

So my plan is to remove all the old paint, bring her down to bare wood. attach mahogany planking "veneer" to the sides and epoxy and glass the bottom and sides. paint the bottom... either white or black?? This wont be a restore as they never came out looking like I want in the end. But I think its going to make a great platform to start with.

The 25hp Elgin, does not have spark. I already removed that and sold it with all the controls for 200 as like I said before I really want to end up with an OMC preferably like this one.

 

[FJ_Russo]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

So to bring everyone up to speed with the progress so far where I'm at.

I have removed the entire interior of the boat. flipped it and gotten it on a cradle. I have also removed all the paint and stripped the hull down to bare plywood. No surprises there either all of the plywood is in great shape no rot or cracks.

I bought some 1x1.5x24" mahogany planks off ebay and have been making my "veneer" I'm using a 1/16th Kerf blade on the table saw and cutting them 1/8" thick and going across the hull of the boat 1.5" at a time LOL along with 4 staples in each piece......

I decided to use titebond III for the Veneer. I know some people will disagree with my decision to use that instead of epoxy however I did some tests of my own with it as well as read some reviews online of others using it for this purpose with great result. My two other purchases have been 3 gallons of Raka Epoxy the start of I'm sure many more gallons. and a 1960 Evinrude big twin. I'm unsure if this is going to be my engine for this project or not. We shall see.

For now its just more cutting and glueing 1.5" at a time and then staple pulling :facepalm: wondering about now if I shouldn't have splurged for the raptor staples and gun. LOL

 

[bluewavecaptain]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

Can I ask why your glassing over that beautiful wood? Seems a shame to cover all that up. Are you going to redo the interior and top as well. A classic wood look would go great with that motor you're looking at. Dress it up with some chrome. Just my $.02.

 

[Pmccraney]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

I think you got a great deal on that boat for net 600 given the condition she is in. Nice score .

I tend to agree with BWC about glassin' her in... If you are going to trailer the boat, I'd be inclined to leave her naked...

 

[FJ_Russo]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

Im sorry I didn't completely explain myself well. I plan to leave the sides bare wood where the mahogany veneer is going. Just a clear coat of epoxy and then varnish. I only plan to glass and paint the very bottom of the hull either white or black. I plan to leave the interior about the same as stock just using mahogony for the benches and seat backs, with a white removable cushion.

Thanms for the replies, I will do my best to keep this updated throughout the process. So stay tuned

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

I think you should do some research on wood boats. They are Glassed with a thin veil of 6oz glass cloth and epoxy. The cloth will practically disappear and the wood will still be as beautiful as ever. The glass gives the wood added protection as well as waterproofing. I'd HIGHLY recommend you glass the entire hull. But...It's your boat and your choice.

 

[FJ_Russo]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

Thanks wood on glass! I assume you would knlw with a name as yours i actually will be glassing the bottom of the hull with 8oz and the sides with 4 oz. I was back and forth between the 6 and the 4 and decided on the 4 after reading a few people complain about the clarity of the 6oz. I have been doing most of my research over at the glen L site and have purchased the book, boat building with plywood by Glen L Witt naval architect. And have been recerencing that for the last year or so for my information. Any advice you have it looks like you have a ton more expierence than i do for sure so please let me know... thank you

 

[FJ_Russo]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

So I have gotten a little more done on the boat and figured I would add some pictures. Currently I have the Mahogany planking on both sides of the Hull. One side the staples have been removed and the new planking has been faired to match up with the bottom of the boat. I also couldn't resist sanding and wetting down a small patch so as to see a glimpse of the final product. for now though, the agenda is just to finish pulling the staples and SAND, SAND, and more SANDING!

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

She's looking good!!! She should be a real beauty when she's sanded and faired and the glass and epoxy goes down.

 

[greenbush future]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

So my plan is to remove all the old paint, bring her down to bare wood. attach mahogany planking "veneer" to the sides and epoxy and glass the bottom and sides. paint the bottom... either white or black?? This wont be a restore as they never came out looking like I want in the end. But I think its going to make a great platform to start with.

The 25hp Elgin, does not have spark. I already removed that and sold it with all the controls for 200 as like I said before I really want to end up with an OMC preferably like this one.
View attachment 188604

I will be finishing a set of similar outboards to match up to my 1960 Lone Star. Mine are 1957 35's and that color is the same as mine too, it just catches my attention. The two I have are still very clean for original, under the cover looks like brand spanking new, I just need new paint and decals for the leg and cover.
The wood work you are doing is really nice stuff, once they are matched up, you're going to have a really nice set up. Keep sending us pictures, it's motivation for all of us. I tend to work hard on mine for a few weeks then life get's in the way for months.

 

[FJ_Russo]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

Thanks Guys!! A set of twin 35's!!!! Now I'm jealous )))) I did some sanding today also got the rest of the staples pulled. Im doing my initial sanding with 50 grit on the belt sander. Evening the boards out and getting rid of the burns from the table saw. Then a 60 grit on the palm sander, followed by 80 grit on the palm sander again. And will be finishing with 120 on the hand sander to get a good feel and to make sure it is a nice even base to lay my stain on. I believe i will be using minwax's water based mahogany stain. But I'm still doing some research on that. When I get to the staining I will make sure to have some pictures to post as motivation! Cheers!!

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

Some water-based stains don't do well w/ oil-based finishes, the inverse is also occasionally true. Not always & not every stain/finish.....

Puddling & poor penetration (adhesion) of the top coat when there is no barrier coat between 1 type of stain & the other type of finish.

Generally, we used oil stain, an oil-based sealer, then water based finish. If the oil sealer had areas of dry brushing, or the sealer was over scuffed after drying in prep for the final finish, the water based finish pulled, pooled &/or puddled in some areas, as the surface tension rose as the finish cured.

I've had adhesion & telegraphing grain when using water based stains under oil based finish. The water based stain will tend to raise the grain & fibers of the wood when it's applied as well.

Just test the products you intend to use & I'd probably stick w/ 1 manufacturer's family of products. That way if there's a problem, ie: you can call 3M & ask about using their water based stain under their finish.

Nice looking wooden hull you've got going there. What color stain are you thinking about for her?
IMHO, a 'clear' stain will usually bring out the traits & character of wood it's applied to. A coat of conditioner &/or sealer often does too..

Sticking around to see how things shape up...

 

[FJ_Russo]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

Jb curt00 have you ever laid epoxy down? Thats my plan, and have heard of adhesion issues using oil based stains under epoxy. My plan was to use a very light tint water base then a 4oz fiberglass cloth and epoxy. Im slightly nervous about the staining step as ive heard of serious issues with it, and rly the mahogany looks darn good on its own. But i wouldn't mind evening it up a bit.

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

No, I've never used epoxy over stain
.
I would test any products you intend to use on an extra piece of mahogany. W/ epoxy you'll probably want to use a STAIN only. Not a wood conditioner, sealer or a combination. If you mentioned planning to use epoxy earlier I missed it....

A slow curing epoxy may aid in adhesion. Test your cured test sample by applying a strip of duct tape, make sure it's well adhered then peel/lift the duct tape. If the epoxy peels off too, it wasn't well adhered. An alcohol based stain can often be a good choice under epoxy. Some do recommend using the water based stains w/ epoxy.

Any stain you choose needs to be WELL dried before applying the epoxy.

Epoxy isn't UV stable, so you'll need to cover the epoxy w/ spar varnish.

Since you're staining, paint wouldn't be a good UV protectant :facepalm:

 

[FJ_Russo]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

Thanks for the advice and knowledge!! Everyone always asks me how I know how to do the things I do... I always answer I don't but someone on Iboats does... LOL

I was reading an article put out by Vintage race boat shop about their staining and varnish process, using Pettit products. I'm leaning that way seems to be some time trusted products! Stain & Varnish Here is the link in case anyone is interested. My thoughts now are, Fiberglass and epoxy the bottom, then paint using interlux bottom side paint. Then do the staining and varnishing using the Pettit products on the sides of the hull and the deck.

But thats all open to change based upon the next bit of advice or random internet article :facepalm:

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

^^^ sounds like a great way to finish a wooden boat.

pix pix pix

 

[FJ_Russo]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

Well I have the Hull finally sanded. I ended up stopping at 100 Grit. I got the Pettit Stain, in Mahogany Brown. I will be starting the staining process maybe even yet tonight. We shall see.... I cant wait to see how this is going to look with some stain on it.

I will get som pictures posted tonight!!

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

Is the Pettit stain oil or water based? What Epoxy are you using? How long are you planning on letting the stain cure before applying the Epoxy base coat? You are Painting the bottom first right? Are you planning on putting a cap on the chines to cover the end grains of the side pieces? This would really help guard against abrasion and aid in waterproofing IMHO.

 

[FJ_Russo]

Re: 1960 Luger Matador Restoration

So I got one side stained tonight... WOW dont use Pettit products if you have band hands... I have no problems and I dont think my fingers are going to go straight for a week. I initially was slightly worried about the evenness of how the stain was going down. But then realized it just takes ALOT of rubbing.After the slight learning curve it started going down very nicely. This filler stain really does fill in the rough spots well. I'm not going to do the other side tonight, gotta let my hands rest a bit. But heres a couple pics, I wanted to get it outside for some better pic quality but it started raining so these are the best I have for now.