3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

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solar7647

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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

Well the new battery cables did it. Once I got the the battery hooked up it had no problem getting over the compression........but no start up!!:(

all that effort to find out the coil is shot!!! I am getting nothing out of it and it has a big crack through it so I am going to try and hunt one down...but I am sure she will fire up once I get a new coil!
 

kozman01

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

Thanks for the information you've been providing. I just picked up a great little 1986 Four Winns 170 with this engine and I've already learned a ton from your posts!! Also, please make sure to post a pic of your oil change contraption tube. I think that may be the first thing I do to the engine. I'm sure many 470 owners are loving this post.
 

solar7647

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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

I have updated several section of the thread thread to answer current questions that I have received.

There has been photos added to the section on the rockers to answer the questions on how the mount to the head, and I have also added photos to show the finished oil drain tube so that people can see how it looks hooked up.
 

solar7647

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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

Well I got out to the local marine shop and picked me up a new coil today. I havent had a chance to install and start though, I will be doing that tomorrow! I can not wait to fire this thing up.

As long as all goes well I will be posting a video of it rummblin in the garage! I will also put the pictures up of the old coil with the nice cresent moon crack on the top, I still dont know how it slipped by me. I geuss the late nights are getting to me!

It will be worth it though, my 2yr old son and 4yr old daughter have been helping me ( well handing me tools I dont need, but its cute) cause they want the boat done so they can get out on the water. They love being out on Lake Erie, my son never get enough of seeing the bing frieghters rolling off the lake into downtown Toledo! I never get sick of seeing it eather!
 

billy4hp

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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

The first thing to do was take care of the head. Now it comes with the factory stamped steel rockers. I have chosen to update these to full roller aluminum rockers reasons being that stamped steel rockers flex and it tends to get worse over time and as they heat up. Aluminum rollers Rockers do not so they are more efficient. They also decrease stress on the lifters and cam and regain the lost power that the head takes up.

The stock ratio of the rockers is 1.73. I purchased Scorpion full aluminum roller rockers of the same ratio, it is important that the ratio is the stock size, if not further modifications will need done. It is also important to note that they are pedestal mount so rollers where though to find for a good price. The killer is they came in a set for a V8 so now I have 8 extra.

*note: The roller Rockers are taller and will need a spacer for the valve cover.

The factory rocker set up:
picture.php


The new Rollers- they sure are purty for something hiden and covered in oil all their life!
picture.php

Just a thought and please don't think I am attempting to "rain on your parade", but adding any aluminum / aftermarket roller rocker is a gamble IMHO as you have just added a bunch of failure points with the fulcrum bearings and roller tip....

The whole (stock rocker arm's flex) is a bit of snake oil when your talking about the relatively low lift of a stock marine camshaft and fairly low valve spring pressures that are used with most hydraulic lifter flat tappet camshafts... In fact with the aluminum rockers you may have actually increased the chance of valve float @ WOT RPM, as the aluminum roller rockers may actually be heavier than the stamped steel rockers arms you removed... This could only be verified by weighing the old rockers versus the new ones.

So with this in mind, now would be a good time to epoxy in a few magnets into the valve spring / rocker arm area to catch flying parts if and when a rocker arm does fail...

This is a pretty common practice in a high performance - competition engine..


ctrp_0810_03_z+stock_car_engine+dyno_test.jpg


No, I don't know a thing about engines..... :)

JMHO, Good luck with your project...
 

solar7647

Lieutenant Junior Grade
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1,218
Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

Just a thought and please don't think I am attempting to "rain on your parade", but adding any aluminum / aftermarket roller rocker is a gamble IMHO as you have just added a bunch of failure points with the fulcrum bearings and roller tip....

The whole (stock rocker arm's flex) is a bit of snake oil when your talking about the relatively low lift of a stock marine camshaft and fairly low valve spring pressures that are used with most hydraulic lifter flat tappet camshafts... In fact with the aluminum rockers you may have actually increased the chance of valve float @ WOT RPM, as the aluminum roller rockers may actually be heavier than the stamped steel rockers arms you removed... This could only be verified by weighing the old rockers versus the new ones.

So with this in mind, now would be a good time to epoxy in a few magnets into the valve spring / rocker arm area to catch flying parts if and when a rocker arm does fail...

This is a pretty common practice in a high performance - competition engine..


ctrp_0810_03_z+stock_car_engine+dyno_test.jpg


No, I don't know a thing about engines..... :)

JMHO, Good luck with your project...

You bring up some very good points! I Gave it a lot of thought and research before adding the rockers, I can assure you of that. I made sure the new rockers were not heavier then the stock rockers, if they where it would kind of defeat the purpose of adding them.

As far as adding failure points I agree, anytime you add moving parts to anything it adds potential failure points but in my case it is a risk I am willing to take to get the benefits.
 

billy4hp

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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

You bring up some very good points! I Gave it a lot of thought and research before adding the rockers, I can assure you of that. I made sure the new rockers were not heavier then the stock rockers, if they where it would kind of defeat the purpose of adding them.

As far as adding failure points I agree, anytime you add moving parts to anything it adds potential failure points but in my case it is a risk I am willing to take to get the benefits.

Glad you know the risks.... ;)

Good luck with you project....
 

solar7647

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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

The photo of the bad coil, you can clearly see the big crack through it!
IMG00357-20100424-1319.jpg


I got the new coil in, hooked everything up and gave they key a turn.............and.........it STARTED!!!!!!!:D:D:D

The link to the video as i said I would!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldeUvKat94Y

Thanks you everyone for your support on this!!
 

solar7647

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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

I am dropping the engine in the boat tomorrow, so I will add that to this thread as well.

Again thanks everyone!
 

Bob_VT

Moderator & Unofficial iBoats Historian
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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

Fantastic job there Young Frankenstein :D
 

solar7647

Lieutenant Junior Grade
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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

I got the motor in its home now!
We mounted the bell housing and the transom mount, got the steering cylinder in and got the motor in!

On the way to the boat.
IMG00358-20100425-1103.jpg


Ready to go in
IMG00359-20100425-1339.jpg


Bell house
IMG00361-20100425-1341.jpg


Transom mount
IMG00362-20100425-1438.jpg


Motor in
IMG00365-20100425-1635.jpg
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
Joined
May 19, 2004
Messages
27,468
Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

...
So with this in mind, now would be a good time to epoxy in a few magnets into the valve spring / rocker arm area to catch flying parts if and when a rocker arm does fail.........

You have made some good points, but how exactly does a magnet help catch aluminium parts?

Solar7647,
Engine looks great. I like the red paint job and flame decals.... :D:D

Chris........
 

solar7647

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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

You have made some good points, but how exactly does a magnet help catch aluminium parts?

Solar7647,
Engine looks great. I like the red paint job and flame decals.... :D:D

Chris........


Thanks, I am glad to have it in! I cant wait to see whats she has on the water!!:D
 

billy4hp

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Jan 31, 2009
Messages
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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

You have made some good points, but how exactly does a magnet help catch aluminium parts?

Solar7647,
Engine looks great. I like the red paint job and flame decals.... :D:D

Chris........

aChris,

Let's see, the magnet would possibly catch (if and when there is a failure):

Roller tip bearing and or axle
Trunion bearing rollers
Trunion bearing race
Pivot axle
Pivot axle snap ring
Pushrod cup

These are the primary components in a roller rocker arm that have a tendency to fail, all of which are made of ferrous material and therefore are magnetic.

Also the magnet would be capable of grabbing pieces of a broken valve spring, retainer and keeper, pushrod, etc...

IMHO, epoxying in a few magnets in strategic areas (oil return paths) when you are building an engine is not a bad idea...

Solar7647,

From you're pictures you have done a very nice job assembling your engine and should be commended on how clean your install looks.... Good job...
 

ericcarr2000

Ensign
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Mar 19, 2010
Messages
903
Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

I agree, I just got done with my rebuild on my 3.7, cant wait till I get her oiut on the water again,:cool:
 

solar7647

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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

I agree, I just got done with my rebuild on my 3.7, cant wait till I get her oiut on the water again,:cool:

Hope she works good for you! Keep up good maintenance so she will stay kicking for a long time.

I have been going through this thread proofreading and making thing flow better and adding info where i felt it needed to be explained a little better so it will be more of a help to anyone who reads it.

Thanks for the kinds words all!
 

85imperial

Cadet
Joined
Mar 2, 2010
Messages
11
Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

Do you have details on the coil you used? Type and manufacture? I don't recall but are you using points or did you upgrade the distributor? Also on the oil filter you mentioned fram #PH5, my engine doesn't have power stering will the same one fit? What type of oil are you using? I'm hoping to finish my rebuild this weekend and am now finishing the bottom end and thinking about fluids. Did you use any added sealers on the gaskets? oil pan and lifter cover in particular. Sorry for all the ???'s but this is my first marine rebuild and heard these engines can be finiky?
 

solar7647

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Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

Do you have details on the coil you used? Type and manufacture? I don't recall but are you using points or did you upgrade the distributor? Also on the oil filter you mentioned fram #PH5, my engine doesn't have power stering will the same one fit? What type of oil are you using? I'm hoping to finish my rebuild this weekend and am now finishing the bottom end and thinking about fluids. Did you use any added sealers on the gaskets? oil pan and lifter cover in particular. Sorry for all the ???'s but this is my first marine rebuild and heard these engines can be finiky?

Ok In order:
1) Sierra coil number is SIE18-5433

2) Using points

3)The oil filter should be the same, but I would recomend you use a marine filter or better brand auto filter, I only used Fram cause it was cheap and the oil will need changed after the first time the engine gets to temp because of all the lube the machine shop put on the internal parts. So once that is done I will be installing the proper Sierra oil filter.

4) I am using a streight 40 weight oil. Mercruiser recomends streight 30 or 40 weight depending on the min temp you operate in. NO SYNTHETICS! and no multi weight oils!

5) No I did not add any sealers on any of the gaskets because, they are all cork or paper or some kinf of porase material that obsorbs fluid. The valve cover and oil pan are both cork, so they may leak at first just a very little but the gasket will soak up the oil and swell. Once that happens they wont leak, given they were installed right.

The engine does have some corks but all engine have there issues. I have found that good maintance and preventive care solve those issues.

I for example I do two oil changes a season. One at the begining and one in the middle regardless of hours reason being, because I have a young familly and we can put alot of stress on the boat...wakeboarding, tubing, skiing, fishing and we can get into some crazy water conditions on Lake Erie. I also am a coolant Nazi! If the engine is getting hot I dont wait for it to over heat I start looking for issues!

After every weekend before packing the boat up for the week I do a hole check of the motor, drive and hull...cleaning plugs, checking wires, battery, fluids, looking for leaks and loose bolts. That way if there are any issues or damage I have the entire week to get them fixed right and I am not trying to fix problems with the family breathing down my neck cause they want to go out, or i am not putting my family in any risks because I jerry-riged something real quick.

But I dont do that cause the engine, I do it cause my wifes, my two kids and any other freinds or family that is out with us,their safty is on the line. I would do it no matter what engine my boat had.

The way I see it is, the engine I just rebult was bult in 1987 or before, and has lasted 23 years until it needed major work and the only reason it got rebuilt was to prevent an issue of major failure caused by a sloppy piston, the engine cant be as bad as people say.

Happy to share any info I can!
 

achris

More fish than mountain goat
Joined
May 19, 2004
Messages
27,468
Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

Hi Solar,

To protect your work/engine/friends and family you could now put a WATER PRESSURE ALARM and gauge in... This will pick up a loss of cooling water WAAAAY before the engine gets hot enough to cause any problems. :D

Cheers,

Chris.......
 

badkins50

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Sep 20, 2009
Messages
676
Re: 3.7L 180HP rebuild with pics!

Hi Solar, I've been following this thread since the beginning and it awesome you took the time to do it as detailed as you did. Thanks, you will be helping a lot of us out who maybe had doubts about doing things to our motor. Keep up the good work and thanks again.

PS, Thanks for the info on the water pressure alarm achris.
 
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