'56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

[KathyD19]

Hey everyone, need some more advice! I've taken my restored boat/motor out on the lake 3 times so far since getting it up and running and it's fired up and run perfectly. Until today. I was getting ready to take my mom out for the first time on it (in more than 40 years!) so I had it in the water and gave it a little test run. It idled at neutral just fine but when I shifted into forward it jerked hard then began to run forward alright but when I opened up the throttle a bit, it slipped back into neutral. I checked it at several different throttle positions and it didn't matter if it was slow, medium or faster, it would. out of the blue, slip back into neutral with a jerk. The only thing different from when I last ran it was that I had to take the hood off to do something to it so I had to remove the shift cable but I re-attached it just the same as it had been. When I have the motor turned off and I push the shift lever forward and back, the lever on the motor moves accordingly just fine. So it seems to be slipping out of forward when running but I don't know what to do to adjust that? Help?

 

[kfa4303]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

Hello again Kathy. There are a few things to check. The simplest would be to try to switch it into/out of the gears manually, without using the control cables, then you know the issue is on the motor as opposed to the controls. Assuming it's on motor, the simplest thing to check is the shift rod connector, found behind the little plate on the exhaust leg. Make sure both the upper and lower shift rods are secured tightly in the coupler. What does if feel like when it goes out of gear? If it feels like you're hitting a submerged object, then you've probably got a worn clutch dog, which isn't that uncommon on older motors. The clutch dog is a ring that is found in the gear case on the propshaft between the FWD and REV gears. It has several lobes on it which engage the inner surface of the gears. Overtime they can become worn. The only thing you can do is open the gear case to visually inspect it. If it's worn, you'll need to get new one. Check ebay, marineengine.com, or a WTB ad on aomci.org. You may as well reseal the lower unit while you're at it too. You can get a reseal kit here at iboats for about $25. Now, if the motor feels more like it's just over revving, rather than hitting a submerged object, then you probably have a spun hub in your prop. You can check by taking a sharpie and drawing a level line across the back of prop and hub surfaces and take the motor out on the water and get it up to speed. Afterwards, remove the prop and see if the line is still level. If it's level, then your hub is ok. If not, then you'll need to get it rehubbed at a prop shop for about $40. Give these a try and let us know what you find.

 

[KathyD19]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

Thanks for the quick and informative reply, kfa! Yes it does feel like I'm hitting something under the water, that's what the "jerk" feeling is. I can manually move the lever on the motor with no problem. I knew I was going to have to remove the lower unit to replace the impeller as routine maintenance but I hadn't gotten around to that yet since I didn't know what I was doing. Guess I'm going to have to dig in and figure it out. So first I need to check the shift rod connector and if that's ok then it's on to the clutch dog, correct? Guess this boating stuff is a never-ending "To Do" list.

 

[boobie]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

Kathy, do you have a good service manual for your mtr ??

 

[KathyD19]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

Yes, I do believe I have that printed out and in my file cabinet.

 

[82rude]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

there is no need to run around for the clutch dog .go to your local brp dealer it is still available or at least was last year or 2 as i got one for a 56 30hp from them.sad part is i had the blasted box right beside me where im typing for the longest time, but not no more.

 

[KathyD19]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

Ok, I feel stupid asking but what is a brp dealer? And when I replace the clutch dog, do I need to (or should I) replace the forward gear as well?

 

[82rude]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

brp dealer is or was johnson evinrude dealer .brp now owns the rights to them.that foward gear is pricey.but if its your clutch dog you shouldnt have to replace the foward or rev gear under normal conditions.i dont know if anybody else mentioned this but a easy way to tell if its your clutchdog is to disconnect the shift cables put in foward gear manually and hold on to the shift lever as the motor is running in foward .if it jumps in your hand at anytime its the cuitch dog.

 

[KathyD19]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

I'd have to take it back to the lake to try that method since my only other means of running it in water is using a big old trash can and I was told I can only run it in neutral in the can because if I put it in gear in there it will eat up the can. The shift cable does still make the lever on the motor move correctly and the motor lever moves freely with no hitching when I do that by hand (without motor running). It was humming along fine in neutral then I shifted forward (I have since read that you are supposed to shift hard and firmly, not ease it into gear but I never knew any of that and I think I moved the shift lever forward at a steady, not too slow pace, but not in a fast firm motion either, don't know if that affected it). When I put it into forward it jerked and jumped forward then acted ok. Then it acted like it hit something in the water (but I know it didn't, it was still right in the deep marina bay) and the lever moved out of forward and into neutral. I pushed it forward again and all was ok for a minute or so then it jerked again and was back into neutral. I tried running it forward and holding the shift lever in forward but it would still "clunk" and try to go back to neutral so I gave up and brought it back to the dock. It ran perfectly fine the last 3 times out. The only difference is that I had unhooked that cable to take the hood off but I re-hooked it correctly. I also added a transom saver rod and have had the motor tilted up kind of high a few times installing the thing. Don't know if maybe I knocked something loose in the process? I'm going to check what kfa suggested tomorrow when it's light out..the shift rod connecter. Lord knows I could use a break and have something just be a simple fix for a change!!!

 

[82rude]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

hope it works out for you ,but if not the clutch dog part number is 375783. its between 60 to 80 bucks.yes kfa suggested marineengines.com excellent site ,lots of pics of all the partsand numbers.http://www.marineengine.com/parts/v...ntage-evinrude-johnson/376750/37675000001.htm click on this link.

 

[82rude]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

for an example crowley marine has your clutch dog available new for 65 bucks .on their web site select johnson parts and type in 375783 in the search colum like this http://www.crowleymarine.com/parts.cfm

 

[Willyclay]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

So first I need to check the shift rod connector and if that's ok then it's on to the clutch dog, correct?

Before you start taking the lower unit apart, there is another adjustment for the shift lever on the motor that can be made. It should be in your manual and may differentiate procedures between "early models" and "late models". Yours is an "early model".

I have followed all of your threads and some members posting in this thread may not be aware that you reported running 32MPH on GPS just one week ago with no problems. Your previous outings did not indicate this problem either. This makes me ask, "what was different?" Even a minor adjustment of the remote control cable or slight slippage of the shift linkage could cause this problem. Water incursion into the gearcase could cause this problem. My experience tells me it is usually something simple. Good luck!

EDIT: Here's a link to instructions for connecting remote controls. Maybe it will help.

http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/03/columns/max/04/drawing.gif

 

[Willyclay]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

Don't want to distract you from your current issue with the gearshift but here is a bit of info about the throttle that applies to tiller-equipped motors converted to remote control like yours:

OMC recommended that the “friction disk” be removed from the twist grip in order to lessen the loads on the throttle control, when remote controls were installed.. The twist grip can be removed by removing the single screw that retains it. Fish the disc and the disc spring out from inside the grip, and reattach the grip. There will now be much less friction on the throttle linkage. Incidentally, reattaching the grip with the disc and the spring in place can take some doing, since there are tabs and ‘flats” on the grip shaft which have to be aligned.

 

[KathyD19]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

Thanks Willyclay!! I am going to go outside and take a look at things now. I really feel like it had something to do with the the shift cable because I had removed it then put it back on and that's the ONLY thing that changed from this running like a dream to doing what it's doing now. I'll let you know!

 

[82rude]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

sometimes its just simple coincidence willclay, nothing more nothing less.to check for proper shift alignment should only take 5 minutes tops.to take apart the lower unit and check for a worn clutch dog is also simple .sorry ,i find it easy, but its not rocket science.just pay close attention to the parts and their sequence.as a matter of fact for people that dont have a photografic memory a digital camera is really handy,take lots of pictures.fortunatelly for me i just have to look once and i remember how to put all the parts back exactly where they came from.i dont understand it but its just happened in the last few years.sure comes in handy when you drop all the parts all over the floor.lol.kathy, i hope its something simple, all my posts are just to help you find the part if worse comes to worse.

 

[KathyD19]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

I was outside looking it over and my brother happened to drive by so I grabbed him for his opinion (HE, unlike me, is a gifted mechanic). He thought it might need some adjusting on the shift cable as well and tinkered with it a little bit then declared it seems like it's all put together just fine. He had to go before I could make him show me how to take the lower unit apart (smart guy!). I think I will take it out on the lake one more time to see if whatever "tinkering" he did made any difference and then if not, I'll start taking apart the LU. 82rude, you're a lucky guy that you have photographic memory for this stuff, that sure would make it easier! I'm self-taught on all of this, had no prior mechanical skills before taking on restoring this motor, which Willyclay has watched me mess with from the beginning. Hahaha. Everything I have done has been from the advice on this forum and YouTube. Whenever I tackle a repair, I have always used me camera to take pictures along the way so I'll remember how to put it back together, that's such a great bit of advice. I read the service manual info about doing the job and I'm just going to have to sit down, maybe over the weekend and "get 'er done" I guess. I am not the kind of person that learns best from reading something, I'm more hands-on and need to be shown but I generally don't have anybody around here that can help/show me. So yeah, it's a bit of a struggle for me but I've made it this far and I have to see it through. I most definitely appreciate advice from everyone!!

 

[82rude]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

keep at it kathy, your doing just fine .i had no clue i had a excellent memory for parts until one day i dropped my 33 hp lower unit parts from the case to all over the floor.after clean up i just thought about it and had it back together in minutes.its come in handy lots of times working on the old motors.funny thing is i couldnt even remember that yesterday was tuesday,lol.

 

[kfa4303]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

No worries Kathy, ee've all been there. I've had many a motor that would "run" great, but wouldn't "go" anywhere because of gear issues. Either way, opening the gearcase really isn't that bad. Hopefully, the gears themselves are ok. If not place a WTB ad on aomci.org. I had a bad dog and gears on my '66 20 hp and I got a matched set of gears, prop shaft and clutch dog for less than what many other sites wanted for the dog alone. Good luck. Keep us posted.

 

[Willyclay]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

I think I will take it out on the lake one more time to see if whatever "tinkering" he did made any difference and then if not, I'll start taking apart the LU.

Kathy knows that I'm her biggest fan and also that I make no claims of expertise! When you get it to the lake, please make your initial run with the gearshift remote control cable disconnected from the shift lever on the motor. That should give you a chance to see if something has changed mechanically since August. Good luck!

 

[82rude]

Re: '56 Johnson Javelin Shift/Throttle problem

i keep going back to kathy,s earlier post where about 1/2 way down she says she held the shift lever manually and it still jumped.that leads me to believe only 2 things are possible.1 shift rod is not properly aligned or 2 clutch dog is going.am i reading it correctly willyclay?post at 2:14 am.after going through and participating in this post i now feel a urge to dig out my 53 rude (25hp tiller)and work on it.blast you kathy,lol now the work starts!