OB vs IB

[jasoutside]

Re: OB vs IB

No mention of the superior ability of outboards when it comes to shallow running.

Yup, I'll give you that one. But on bigger boats (like Kelly's Islander) we are talking big water anyway. Small boats + OB's for small waters, eh!

Didn't see a reference to the capability to have 2-3 outboards on a normal sized boat. This offers the type of redundancy that allows folks to venture out into big water with confidence.

Kicker

The only other issue I see is that many of us are wrenching on outboards too, have you seen how busy the Johnnyrude forum is? Especially on the older ones they are super easy to take apart, replace parts and put back together.

I say it's even on wrenching, although newer DFI outboards are equally difficult for shade tree folks as the I/Os. So a draw there I'd say.

Agreed, good old fashioned carbed is prolly equal headache to the IO. EFI/DFI prolly goes to the tech.

The pricing is a bit off as well, since I can go grab a sweet 115hp outboard locally for 750 right now Maybe you are looking at newer ones?

Yah, if I am going OB I am looking at later model 150/175/200 and here is what I see all day long (kinda on par with a good V6 175 - 220 hp)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Merc...at_Parts_Accessories_Gear&hash=item33612b60b9

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2000...at_Parts_Accessories_Gear&hash=item256098c54b

Once in a while there will be a big OB at around $3,000 - sans controls and prop and still have to mount that bracket. $$$

I haven't yet seen a nice, later model OB in that hp range for less than $3K. I look too.

Still just rough numbers though.

 

[PKomrowski]

Re: OB vs IB

In my experiance, and learing from many engineers that work on OB's and thousands of running hours OB dont even compare.

Most the guys that like them are the guys that have low hours per year running. Or they have the rare OB that stays together without alot of begging. I know alot of guys (boat wrenches) that are master engineers that laugh at the design of most OB, they just will not last. The new ones are of cource designed much different, like the ETecs and such, but many older ones are just asking to break down. I dont have to even talk about how long a Chevy straight 6 or a small block 350 will last, they are well designed as are many of the IB motors. What Im describing dose not apply if your only spending 50 to 100 hrs a year on the water but if your racking in some serious run time, you will not be asking this question in just a few years. I wish I had a dollar for every time I heard a mechanic stay "I have never seen a well designed Outboard". I dont dislike them all together, as I have an 60hp ETec but its 3 year old, and dose not nor ever will have 100s of hours of use per year its on a duck boat, and that motor is a beast, it dose everything perfect for now. But my main ride is a 350 chevy and for that one to go hundereds of hours a year is not a big deal.

 

[Bwana Don]

Re: OB vs IB

$1300; New SEI upper and lower outdrive
$300; junl 3.0 liter mercruiser
$800; total rebuild on junker

$2400; New/refurbished powrtrain

Worse case you have a new powertrain.

What's a new/refurbed 120 hp outboard go for?

 

[Huron Angler]

Re: OB vs IB

$1300; New SEI upper and lower outdrive
$300; junl 3.0 liter mercruiser
$800; total rebuild on junker

$2400; New/refurbished powrtrain

Worse case you have a new powertrain.

What's a new/refurbed 120 hp outboard go for?

http://lansing.craigslist.org/boa/2127053220.html

Not sure about refurbed, but you can get a 115hp that runs great, with controls for $850 That's 115 horses and you can use all of them, nothing lost on the way to the prop.

I got my 80hp Merc for about $250 and two new carbs will run 75 bucks to get her running 100%. The guy basically gave it to me with the boat.

It's not reasonable to compare new/almost new outboard pricing to junked I/O pricing. You'd have to look at used outboards that are very cheap to buy and might need some work.

 

[North Beach]

Re: OB vs IB

Guys this thread and all the other I/O vsOB threads are just like all the ford/chevy threads. I drive a ford and some really weird folks like chevy. same thing here!!!

 

[Pugetsound]

Re: Starcraft on clist!

Re: Starcraft on clist!

Most older OBs that are in use have 30=40 years use on them. The last 4 OBs I used were 72 on up to 84 that in years is pretty good service in years. That comes with very good care. I was always working on little things with the I/O but very little on the outboards .Its like people the more you take care of your self the longer you will be healthy and able to do what you want. Im 73 and do what ever I want but like boats, I have to take care of myself . I do know that in a long term of use the OB is going to cost less than a I/O $$ wise for mechinical cost. Kelley you decide what willl work for YOU. I run big miles with present boat and did with my I/Os also. SERVICE tells the life span of a average OB or a I/O. You have to live with the cost of gas as we we all will. If that is a BIG factor as it may well be at this time than ,go with the I/O. It will use considerably less fuel.

 

[Bwana Don]

Re: OB vs IB

NB, in my not so humble opinion Ford trucks rock, Chevy muscle cars rule. Give me a hi-boy and a Z-28 and I'm as happy as a pig in the mud.

I can tell you one thing for sure I can't wait to get my little 3 liter Chevy out on the water and run the snot out of her. I'm going to fish and fish and fish......

The most pressing question I have is, who do I root for Sunday, Bears or Packers? What beer do I drink, Coors or Molson?

HA, I don't know outboard prices, it was an honest question (first time) I/O prices I know pretty well. My labor not included, or that rebuild on the I/O can go way up. Sounds like for a G you can get a decent outboard, smelly 2-stroke that is.

Peace out, go Bears. I graduated from Wheaton Central High School in Illinois. Molson wins also.

 

[Huron Angler]

Re: OB vs IB

The most pressing question I have is, who do I root for Sunday, Bears or Packers? What beer do I drink, Coors or Molson?

I can't choose between Bears/Packers any more than when Ohio State plays Notre Dame in football

I vote for Labatt's on the beer though...

NB we are just having a little fun since it's winter and the boats are put up/being worked on

 

[ezmobee]

Re: OB vs IB

Lots of pluses and minuses in each camp. I personally favor outboards and wouldn't personally own an I/O (even if it was free). That being said, I don't think converting an I/O hull to an outboard is a practical solution unless you were given a proven outboard very cheaply. I think a rebuilt long block and an SEI drive is a much wiser investment because as indicated by others in this thread, you'd be getting a new I/O powerplant for the price of a used outboard with probably a lot of hours on it.

My favoritism towards outboards comes mainly from the fact that if two identical SC hulls were sitting next to each other in a field neglected for years.....one has an old V4 JohnnyRude on it, the other a 120 Mercruiser.......the outboard has a great possibility of taking you for a ride on the lake with nothing other than a battery and some mixed gas. The I/O is going to need $1000 in maintenance (if you don't do the work yourself) done to it before you can safely shove off.

My project versus Kev's project is perfect anecdotal (and yeah that's all it is) evidence of this.

The engine, and I mean just the engine, of an I/O is simpler to work on. No doubt. The multiple carbs on the larger outboards really ratchet up the complexity. However, all that other stuff between the block and the lower unit, well an outboard just doesn't have that stuff to deal with. The fuel economy of an I/O is better. Although my V4 does just fine for me, I know if I were to step up to a 6cyl outboard, I'd be really sucking down the gas. The aesthetic thing is a non-issue for me. I grew up with and have all my experience with outboards so to me an I/O looks odd. As for interior space, I think we can all agree the giant splashwells on SCs pretty much kill the advantage there that outboards would typically have.

 

[86 century]

Re: OB vs IB

I have to ad that when i rebuilt my ss i put the 20gal tank under the deck thinking it would be plenty. Have since added a 17 gal under the splash well in an effort to not buy as much fuel at the marina $$$$$$.

Also should mention my 200merc has had some modification not sure on details heck as far as i know they just made it use more fuel.

 

[Pugetsound]

Re: OB vs IB

My V6 200 HP Johnson 1975 On my 22 Holiday gets I feel fairly good miles on a tank, I have never ran it dry and ALWAYS take a 6 gal tank and hose out in the salt water. Works for me. Oh the on board tank is 18 gal only

 

[jasoutside]

Re: OB vs IB

You are definitely right NB, same IO vs. OB debate, different day. BUT, what else are we going to talk about? Synthetic vs. Dino Oil? Pour in foam vs. Noodles? Alum hull vs. Glass? Marine Grade Ply vs. Exterior Grade Ply? Shoot man, I'll take the IO/OB debate over all those others.

I am finding that the conversation around here is pretty civilized though. I read through EZ's response twice and I can't find any IO name calling

Well, lets see if we can bump up the intensity a little. That wood chuck has since keeled over from rabies getting the better of him. I did find a cute little bunny rabbit though. You OB guys, get ready for the pain....

 

[Deadwood]

Re: OB vs IB

I love it earlier in the movie when Cleese says "I fart in an outboards general direction."....

 

[Starcraft Enterprise]

Re: OB vs IB

Maybe I will mount my I/O on an outboard bracket.

 

[airshot]

Re: OB vs IB

Having a great time reading the I/O vs O/B info, actually read some things I had not thought of. A couple things that stirred my interest though....why does one consider an OB to be able to run in shallower water? If one is talking about equal size boats for example a 22 foot Islander such as I have, with trim and tilt my I/O will run in less then 24" of water if I have to, I cannot see an OB running in much less on that size boat. Also keep in mind that the OB hanging off the back will cause the stern to set a bit lower in the water than an IO where more of the weight is on the inside.
This Islander is my very first IO, been an OB man for 45 years, in small boats the OB is king, but as one gets above 20' (my opinion) the IO moves the OB over and becomes the king.
One thing I noticed was not mentioned (or I missed it) was the cost of OB and IO replacement parts, my experience has shown that OB parts are more costly than IO parts. Many times we can sub a car part for an IO but we are beholding to the high price OB manufacturers. Not meant as an insult but the OB manufacturers do have a substantial markup. I recently replaced a choke solenoid on a 40 HP jonny, of course an OMC was the only thing that would fit, $152.00 for a choke solenoid and yes I did shop around. Similiar part for an IO was less than $25.00.
I would like to see a study on IO vs OB associated costs for ownership over 15 years for the two, from initial cost, to include maintenance, fuel costs for same number of hours of operation etc. I would bet in the long run average, they would be pretty close. Thanks for allowing my two cents...

Airshot

 

[Starcraft Enterprise]

Re: OB vs IB

Having a great time reading the I/O vs O/B info, actually read some things I had not thought of. A couple things that stirred my interest though....why does one consider an OB to be able to run in shallower water? If one is talking about equal size boats for example a 22 foot Islander such as I have, with trim and tilt my I/O will run in less then 24" of water if I have to, I cannot see an OB running in much less on that size boat. Also keep in mind that the OB hanging off the back will cause the stern to set a bit lower in the water than an IO where more of the weight is on the inside.

I thought the same thing. Maybe a jackplate?
And I/O's do sit lower in the water, cast iron 4 stroke I/O engine alot heavier. Outboard aluminum. Been on a Starchief With 100 hp outboard and 120 hp Mercruiser I/O, I/O sits stern heavy.
But as far as the outboard being faster, they had similar hole shots and top speeds. Plus or minus depending on prop. And outboard had a fresh rebuild during mid ownership.

 

[Bwana Don]

Re: OB vs IB

Outboards are lower in initial cost. Lower to maintain overall. Use 2x as much gas on an 18 foot and over.

Which is better for YOUR intended use? You have to weigh the pros and cons. For me I think the I/O will be all right. If I had an outboard I'd probably say the same thing.

EZ summed it up pretty well, in a very adult like manner I might add. Jasoutside on the other hand is like myself, your garden variety poop starter. If there's a scrum anywhere he's somewhere close by.

Jason, the Holy Grail is so funny. Only a few things are better than that, Star Trek TOS & TNG, I guess that's it. Sanford and Son comes close, Red Green and Benny Hill come close too.

... and your Father smelt of Elderberries. LMAO

 

[jasoutside]

Re: OB vs IB

your garden variety poop starter. If there's a scrum anywhere he's somewhere close by.

Who me?

 

[North Beach]

Re: OB vs IB

Sorry guys I was trying to be funny and throw a jab at E and the OB weirdies. Guess I'm losin my touch!

 

[mphy98]

Re: OB vs IB

No mention of the superior ability of outboards when it comes to shallow running.

Didn't see a reference to the capability to have 2-3 outboards on a normal sized boat. This offers the type of redundancy that allows folks to venture out into big water with confidence.

There is a reason that the Coast Guard runs dual outboards on their rigs. Try installing two I/O's in a boat smaller than 28' and see how far you get.

This scores big points with me since I like heading out into the big lake and also be safe about it. A Minn Kota outdrive mount is NOT gonna get you back to port against wind/waves.

The only other issue I see is that many of us are wrenching on outboards too, have you seen how busy the Johnnyrude forum is? Especially on the older ones they are super easy to take apart, replace parts and put back together.

I say it's even on wrenching, although newer DFI outboards are equally difficult for shade tree folks as the I/Os. So a draw there I'd say.

The pricing is a bit off as well, since I can go grab a sweet 115hp outboard locally for 750 right now Maybe you are looking at newer ones?

Where can you get that 115 for 750? I might be interested