Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

[MikDee]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

Looking Good ! Sharp Boat! Have you thought about using light gray paint instead of off-white on the inside, I don't think that would yellow like off-white. Plus, it would go better with the red. Good Luck, Mike D.

 

[Montura newbie]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

I really like the job you are doing and you were very resourceful in finding the outdrive and engine. This may seem odd to ask, but I didn't see this in your posts. What year and size is the boat?

I used chemtol B12 to clean the inside of my gas tank and it worked very well. My tank was plastic though.

As for your windshield, are you going to try to make the one that you bought work or are you going to keep looking for the perfect fit? Earlier in the thread you'd mentioned something about a windscreen... what was that idea? I'm only asking because I have a very similar project going on with a 1997 Sea Ray 175 (I have a thread on it here), and I will need a new windshield also.

Thanks for the props, it's appreciated. I will find a way to make the curved windshield I bought work. I think i have it figured out, be sure I'll post the results. As for the windscreen idea... It was going to be used primarily to pass inspection, or until I found the curved style. Like a bass boat or a Yamaha jet boat, kind of like a motorcycle screen, just a little bubble plastic ove reach hump or whatever they're called.

It is a 1995 Monterey montura 196, well I should say most of it. I have some pictures on my camera from tonight's episode of putting it on the right trailer. I do NOT recommend it! I'll post them tomorrow.

 

[Montura newbie]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

Thank you for the compliments, the only reason I was looking at the off white was due to a little fading on the gel coat that is on there right now. This summer will be mostly testing and ensuring we are moving in the right direction. Adding a few things as we go along, making upgrades changes, and betterments. End of the season we will decide on gel coat colors and designs. I'm leaning towards a 2014/15 graphic and color. This was an impromptu project, I saw it, went and got it, and started it, I did not thnk I would find all the parts so quickly. (I actually counted on it) I was going to get a new truck and go a little wild with it, that's now on hold.

Mildee I like your motto. I have 2...
FIO = FIGURE IT OUT
MIH= Make it Happen

 

[Montura newbie]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

Alright the drive is finally out! Now I need everyone to take a look at the insides and tell me what you think? That top steering nut never came out; I pulled the two allen bolts out lifted the rest straight up and it fell right out. The u joints appear to be all there and solid, however, not slick and greasy, more like grimey. Much like what we cleaned out of the motor bay area and under the tank. Waiting for more pictures to upload; but there are some of the trailer, with the new carpet and a quick shot of black paint here and there.

 

[Montura newbie]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help







Here are some shots of the u joints, exhaust, water intake. Yes, I realize the the cable is still connected. I did not have all the tools I needed, It is shot so I will just cut it unless I here from you guys to not cut it. The rubber sleeve was shaved off in one spot and the cable underneath is rusted. It may have been smushed under the motor by accident; but either way it appears it should be replaced.

As for the "bearing" Zool, any update on that? do you mean whats hiding behind the 6 bolts that have to come off next? Or is that something different all together.

Now that I have the drive out, what parts should I pay attention too, replace, clean and reuse, what should I use to paint the drive and shield (once I get it out), what about the zinc? anoids? The bellows kit I ordered comes with the 2 bellows intake tube, and intake tube holder on to. Im gonna call it a thermostat cover for the drive; I'll be corrected soon enough.

I'll work on figuring out how to get the boat transfer pictures from my email to photobucket in the mean time! Again I don't recommend my version; but you have to remember I'm still only in under 700 bucks on this project. The worst thing that could have happened was I dropped it and could sell the parts I have for far more then I have spent, and start over having learned ALOT from my new buddies on this forum. Its great and I have told everyone I can about how much help, and non judgmental opinions I have received.

As for now and always, THANK YOU EVERYONE, especially Zool! If you get his help people listen to this guy! Couple more pics of the motor sitting coming up next.

 

[Montura newbie]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help


I just used the compressor a little and got some of the dust off.



The trailer before and after pictures finally came through, out of sync; but what do you expect from a free photobucket source.

 

[zool]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

Here's the deal on the PDS bearings. Most AQ Volvo boats have the original set, because changing the forward one involves removing the engine. There's no telling when will let go. You could very well grease them up, and they could last for your tenure on this rig...if they let go, its a big job. I dont have a recommendation about it except that its not something you want to defer to next year...you either do it when the flywheel cover is on the bench, or you take your chances...



Ill get back to u on the paint...and your drive looks like the "flying nun" with that bolt on stuff

Whats the deal with that skeg plate?

 

[zool]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

I cant seem to post the procedure link, maybe its blocked by Iboats...Ill PM it to you if you need it

 

[Montura newbie]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

Here is the NOT recommended boat transfer pictures!





The skeg plate has a couple of dings in it, and I have no idea what the other bolt on stuff is or why its there. No clue where this motor was run other then the id sticker on the boat was NV. I absolutely would like the link, I'm no longer terrified what the manual is going to tell me. I think I have read it twice so far to become familiar with the parts and pieces.

Any thoughts on the u joints, the corrosion on the water intake, or the bell housing surface coming through the transom shield that connects the drive shaft?

Do these parts appear to be in good condition/normal at this point or are there big warning signs that I am not recognizing because I don't know any better? Don't bail on me now guys; I've tried to keep up with the pictures to keep your interest up.

I will be replacing the PDS bearings now as I would like to make the future repairs minimal. Obviously with everything in pieces at this point will IMO make them more bearable with your help.

I am going over this afternoon to remove the transom shield; so I can get to the bell housing and bearings, I ordered the Sierra Bellows kit from Amazon Prime. I will bring the drive and shield home to clean and prepare for paint; planning on using a scotchbrite just to knock the surface even. I have read I do not want to bring it down to bare metal. Oh and should I order the zinc kit also?

 

[Montura newbie]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

Zool, I tried to PM you and your full; Im sure with the tons of people you help on here. Just fyi.

 

[zool]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

Don't worry Montura, I wont bail on you lol..Im just working a lot right now, and stealing time to read these boards..

Prolly a wise choice to do the PDS now, its only like 50 bux for all the parts new...I didn't realize the PM was full, ill get to that when I can. What I will do is paste the procedure in here, so anyone who finds this thread will have it too, and not run into a dead end.
Ill try to get to that tonight.

For now tho, your drive coupling parts look normal after 30+ years of service. The flywheel cover (bellhousing) looks fine. The six bolts you were referring to is for the clamping ring, to seal the drive to the FC. You just bend back the tabs, and remove the bolts, use some wd40 or whatever you have and try not to break them off. Looks like you have the course spline coupler and shaft, and that looks good, no abnormal wear. The Ujoint has 2 spiders in them, you can clean it all up and change them if you want, but that can be done later as it just involves the drive removal.

The white corrosion on the water tube should clean up fine too. Yes, replace the zincs.

As for painting the drive, I would remove the skeg cover and dole fin thing, and set it aside til the end, try it as factory intended 1st on your boat, if you feel you need them later, then bolt them back on.

Chips and gouges in the drive can be filled and faired with jb weld. You don't need to remove the old VP paint, just dewax it, sand it, fill, sand. If you have bare aluminum spots after that, post the pics and we'll deal with that when you decide what paint you will use.

You can get the Volvo Penta rattle cans for the factory color for about 14 bux each...they have VP primer, Paint, and clear. Or you can use something else if you want, and try to match the VP color (white)

http://www.***********************/paint.htm

Gotta run for now, BBL

ugg, still cant post parts links

Ill get you the link to the VP paint later

 

[zool]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

Heres the pds replacement procedure on a 280 drive/225d. Its from a guy named Rick from another site, he knows these drives well, and has helped me in the past with parts needed.

" the two bearing PDS is easiest to remove from AFT.
Remove seals, remove the two large AFT snap rings.
With a rather large brass drift and good sized hammer, drive the PDS AFT..... it will come out.
If need be, apply heat the flywheel cover in this area.... the heat will expand it some, and most often will release the bearing so that it can slide out freely.

Once out and on the bench, you'll then remove the small C-clip that secures the 6206 bearing to the shaft.
Remove the 6206 bearing, and install the new "open" 6206 onto the PDS at this time.
Replace the small C-clip.


The two large AFT snap rings install at this time.
Now the new "open" 6007 bearing can be driven into place, followed by it's large snap ring.





Clean out the grease cavity.... purge the grease port.... and install the PDS in the reverse order.
DO NOT install seals yet.
You'll want to pre-fill the grease cavity first, until you see grease come through the ball cages.
Do this while spinning the PDS to purge any air.
Now and only now, are the seals installed.

NOTE: Excessive grease pressure can dislodge the FWD seal, so I've been either staking them, or gluing them into position.
If we loose the FWD seal, no future grease will make it's way through the AFT bearing.... the more important bearing!

NOTE:
The fwd seal installs in the conventional direction with the seal "lip" and tension spring facing towards the grease area.
IOW, this oposite side is facing towards the engine.




The aft seal installs in a non-conventional direction with the seal "lip" and tension spring facing towards the transmission area.
IOW, the same side also faces towards the engine making the lip and tension spring face the transmission side.

Reason: the lips hydraulically lock (to a degree) when pressure is against them, so between the two, we want the AFT seal to breach excessive grease pressure..... not the FWD seal.
The AFT seal is NOT intended to be a water seal anyway. If we have water in this area, we have a bigger problem.

Parts:

Industry Standard 6206 and 6007 bearings in the open version in an electric motor grade...... about $14-16 each or so.
Japanese, German or US made................. NO BBQ'd Pork bearings.
The two seals are a 35X62X7mm in TCM or Timken. These are fully rubber encapsulated...... about $6-8 each.
If you need a snap ring, these too are industry standard.... NAPA will have them.

I suggest to people that these are lubed at around the 40 hour mark... or perhaps to not exceed an oil change interval.

Here's two images.
First one shows the position where the bearings/seals are on the PDS and female yoke.
Second one shows what I've been doing to every F/C that leaves my shop. This hose gets fastened somewhere on the engine where it will be visible and easy to get to for greasing.
The OEM grease zirk location sucks.... people forget that it's there!

 

[zool]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

Volvo Penta Exploded view / schematic Connecting Components AQ Drive 280 AQ225D - MarinePartsEurope.com

Heres the exploded view

 

[Montura newbie]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

That perfect!!! As always you come through, and Im ready. I got the motor and drive home and removed the transom shield, y pipe, tilt/trim piece, the steering knuckle (if you will) fell right out. The Y pipe was not interested in coming apart at all, worse case scenario I would break it and have to get another one. I broke out the rubber mallet and went to town, it soon succumbed and came apart.
I wiped a lot of the old grease and slop off and hosed it all down, to start the cleaning process. Now that its all apart I will just clean them one by one.
Now for the transom questions...
Do I have to use a new black gasket on the rear of the transom?
Should I 100% silicone the bolts and holes as well as the top side and bottom side of the gasket when installing it to the new boat.
Am I missing a holder of some sort that holds the steering knuckle in or is that how it works?
Reuse the pressure plate black seals/gaskets?
Planning on using the benchtop wire wheel to clean up the bolts with letting some part soak in CLR for the calcium build up (is that OK)
Is that a Trim and Tilt piece? it has 2 sets of wires coming from it?
What exact grease should I use, drive oil?
As for the u joints, planning on hitting that whole part with chemtol b12 cleaner; when I'm putting it all back together for the final time does that bellow assembly act like a cv boot? Packed with grease?
Also, the prop; I don't remember if I asked. Do I need to replace that or will it work that way it is?

Please add any other helpful hints, possible issues, when putting in the transom?

Thanks again for checking up on me. I'll have more questions on the bearing deal, but I will wait till I have them in hand and taken apart abit. But for now the Flywheel cover comes off now is the next part of that right?



What is this thing?

 

[Montura newbie]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help




Haven't needed heat for any bolts, I did however drench it in wd-40

 

[zool]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

ok, wow, youre rolling right along!

Let me see if I can answer most of these Q's

Do I have to use a new black gasket on the rear of the transom?

From the pic you posted, your sealing strip looks in good shape, as long as its not torn, and still sits proud of the channel it sits in, I would reuse it. A new one is about $120.

Should I 100% silicone the bolts and holes as well as the top side and bottom side of the gasket when installing it to the new boat.


No, you don't need silicone on the bolts, you can put some under the sealing strip, but its not generally needed if the strip is in decent shape, and just makes a mess....you also don't put silicone to seal the edge of the shield to the transom..thats a hack job

What you do need to check is the little o rings that seal your 6 shield bolts, they are VP p/n 850418. they are usually flattened and changing them is a good idea..but they cost around $7.50+- each, and you need 6. Personally, I would save the $120 on the sealing strip, and spring for the o rings...but that's your call.

Leaks usually occur from a warped transom from either rotting, or improper parallelism of the transom cutout...check the width of your cutout in a few places and make sure its not out of wack....it doesn't have to be perfect, just close.

Am I missing a holder of some sort that holds the steering knuckle in or is that how it works?



Im not sure what you mean, ill have to look at that some more...


Planning on using the benchtop wire wheel to clean up the bolts with letting some part soak in CLR for the calcium build up (is that OK)


Clean them up anyway u need to, just respect the threads...


Is that a Trim and Tilt piece? it has 2 sets of wires coming from it?


It looks like you have the tilt and trim system, the trim was an option I believe, and really handy when beaching, cool

Your system is quite different than mine (hydraulic), but I believe the round cylinder motor is 2 wired for the tilt, and the square box on top with 3 wires is the trim..so you may be able to work it with your throttle buttons....maybe

As for the u joints, planning on hitting that whole part with chemtol b12 cleaner; when I'm putting it all back together for the final time does that bellow assembly act like a cv boot? Packed with grease?




The upper bellows just keeps water out of the ujoints, there should be grease fittings on the joinst..you don't pack grease in the whole area. You should grease the splines where the yoke meets the drive shaft tho..

Also, the prop; I don't remember if I asked. Do I need to replace that or will it work that way it is?


The prop doesn't look too bad, but im no prop expert...maybe if its not bent or out of pitch, you could clean it up and paint it, try it out for starters, if you need a different pitch for optimal performance, you can change it later, and save this as a spare...

Il have to get back to u on the grease and plate gaskets...

 

[zool]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

Sierra Spline Grease 18-9200

http://www.iboats.com/Spline-and-Prop-Shaft-Grease/dm/view_id.710816

 

[Montura newbie]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

Im having trouble finding the seals he was referring to, and not 100% sure I have the right bearings. This places bellows are pricey

Shopping Cart
Quantity Product PartNo Weight Price Sub Total:
6 O-ring 850418 0,003 5,28 EUR 31,65 EUR Delete (Transom Bolt orings)

1 Grease 828250 0,036 4,78 EUR 4,78 EUR Delete

1 O-ring 925256 0,002 5,41 EUR 5,41 EUR Delete (y-pipe oring)

1 Zinc anode 832598 0,896 36,55 EUR 36,55 EUR Delete

2 Ball bearing 181105 0,151 19,59 EUR 39,18 EUR Delete (66-71 on the schematic)

3 Retaining ring 914533 0,012 1,39 EUR 4,16 EUR Delete

2 Sealing ring 958860 0,026 18,34 EUR 36,68 EUR Delete

Update Cart
Sub Total: 158,40 EUR
Shipping: 0,00 EUR
VAT 25%: 31,68 EUR
Total: 158,40 EUR

The iboats store, did not have the quantities on 2 items. Rather then piece by piece from all over. Still need some cotter pins and such but this is a start.

There is a store here in Las Vegas I am going to visit before ordering this, but I the list is 90% IMO.

 

[Montura newbie]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

Here is an off topic question for y'all. I just acquired a very old Perko 50-10 Bell, not that im using it on the build. I was curious if anyone would be interested in it for theirs?

 

[zool]

Re: Monterey Montura Newbie - need help

Try Napa for the bearings and seals, they are standard open, deep groove..you don't need to buy VP, they are just rebranded.

6206 Nachi Bearing Open C3 Japan 30x62x16 Ball Bearings - Rakuten.com Shopping

6007 Nachi Bearing Open C3 Japan 35x62x14 Ball Bearings - Rakuten.com Shopping